Member: Vee
Location: midwest
Date: 25 May 2003
Time: 07:32:26
I saw a picture on the wall of one of my first AA meetings, a photo of an AA convention filling the San Diego football stadium. I thought Hey, that's power! I could give it a shot on that basis. So the power of AA carried me to an open mind and finally tp knowledge and understanding of my personal Higher Power. This is working in my life because the promises of the BB are coming true for me. I was at a birthday party last night where there was drinking and watched a man pour the amber fluid over ice. Miracle of all miracles, I accepted his ability to drink and did'nt want to join him!!! I can remember a time not too long ago when I would have got the heeby jeebies from that encounter. Is that the beginnings of restoration to sanity or not!!! So my faith in doing step 2 was not misplaced altogether! These steps are the path to happiness, joy and freedom.
Member: Sito T.
Location: Puerto Rico
Date: 25 May 2003
Time: 08:19:39
The second step is about hope, a Higher Power, and dealing with reality. There is hope, but that hope lies outside ourselves. In the second step we discover our situation is not hopeless. This step introduces the idea that we are not God--- that there is a power geater than ourselves. It is a humbling thought. And that is its purpose. Insanity is doing the same thing over and over, but expecting different results. Ex. (I drove ontoxicated again after getting my first DWI). This higher power is the one that can restore my sanity, but it won't happen by magic. We have to do our part by diligently working the twelve steps. (Info taking from the book "Twelve Step Sponsoring"). God bless all of you and I wish 24 hours of sobriety to all.
Member: Kim V
Location: kvaughn@madison.main.nc.us
Date: 25 May 2003
Time: 09:33:42
Kim V here alcoholic. Came to believe tells me that we didn't always believe in a higher power. What helped me in defining my higher power who I now choose to call God is this. My higher power only has to be a power greater than myself. My higher power does not have to be at fault in all the bad things that happen in this world. That is an unrealistic expectation I use to place upon my higher power. I think this is a common problem other people endure also. That we get mad at God for letting such and such happen. Who ever said God had any control over it to begin with it. Then I came to the conclusion that I was very insane in my active drinking and sometimes even now have some insane moments when I am not working my program. So my faith that my higher power can relieve me of that came to me in a simple way. If tomorrow science proved that there was no God or Higher power, it would not matter because it is my faith and belief in it that I gain my strength from. It is believing as in the act of faith that makes it work for me and after all this is a action program. Thanks for letting me share.
Member: Jen G
Location: NJ
Date: 25 May 2003
Time: 10:09:35
I have a vision of a HP that is somewhat like Vee's. It's the power that I feel when in the presence of other alcoholics who are sober. It's definitely a power outside myself, bigger than myself, like a stadium full of sober people who understand the place where I've been, who have found a better place, and who share that vision with newcomers and each other. That's a higher power for me. This may sound really stupid, but sometimes, I think of certain musicians or other people who I admire who have joined the ranks of the sober after years of abuse. I look at some of them--especially musicians--who are surrounded by a culture and lifestyle that seems to cherish drinking and drugs--and I think, if they can do it, so can I. Is that a higher power? In a certain sense it is in the same way that feeling the power of other sober people is finding a higher power. Anyway, enjoy the holiday weekend. Thanks for being here and listening.
Member: Melissa B
Location: Canada
Date: 25 May 2003
Time: 11:10:53
Step Two began to dawn on me when I was about two weeks sober. It was a Sunday morning and I was sitting and not not really thinking anything when it came to me that though I was still scared and shaky and anxious about the future, I hadn't wanted to have a drink for the previous two weeks. That seemed like the most awesome kind of miracle because I had tried S O H A R D to quit drinking by myself and just couldn't. I realized it couldn't be me keeping me sober and free from wanting to drink, so what was it? That was the beginning and it has grown; my Higher Power is intimately woven into all of my life now, and life is infinitely better. It's yet another Sunday morning and I am so grateful to AA and the steps. Thank you for listening.
Member: John K
Location: Philadelphia
Date: 25 May 2003
Time: 11:34:31
Hi all, John, alcoholic. For me, sanity is a continuing process. Like Sito said, it involves dealing with reality: knowing what the problem is, what the solution is, and then implementing the solution. My problem is that I am hopelessly insane where alcohol is concerned(and in my case other things as well); the solution is working the Steps to find out what my HP(God's) will (what God wants me to do or be instead of what I want, which is my will) in each case, and then doing or being that. That takes courage("all men of faith have courage"), which I develop as I see the Steps working in my life, but first I have to take the action, and the first action is being honest. Honesty has frequently been uncomfortable for me, but I have never--not once--been harmed for being honest. Instead, I've gained the respect of other people and the friendship of respectable peers. Of all the gracious people I have met throughout my life, the very best have been in AA. I have seen them deal, sober, with situations that normal people would drink over! "The next right thing..." It just continues to amaze. Right now what's going on is that I am considering firing my sponsor. He has been dead-on as far as the Program is concerned, but I am worried that I depend on him too much--that I am more an extension of his personality than I am my own man. It's a long-term relationship, too, so it's a difficult decision to make. What is the sane thing to do? I need to grow up; my sobriety will be ensured as long as I continue trying to help others in AA, so there's no worries there. I pray, and talk at meetings, and talk with my peers about it...the answer will come. Thanks.
Member: Anonymous
Location:
Date: 25 May 2003
Time: 15:21:10
Maybe, sanity is 'there is a power greater than the 'human ego'.
Member: Dixie M
Location: MO
Date: 25 May 2003
Time: 16:47:27
I remember my first sponsor told me when I was in doubt of a power greater than myself just look around the room when we are closing our meetings with the lords prayer if that isn't a power greater than myself I don't know what is and the more I am around you amazing people the more thankful I was spared a life bound with nothing but a hell on earth Dixie
Member: Carlc
Location: NM
Date: 25 May 2003
Time: 17:50:14
What finally got me to TAKE the second step was pain, What did I need God for? I wasnt insane I had been in the program not drinking for 8 years I had a pretty young girl friend, money in the bank. a nice car, enough money to live good and yet I wanted to jump into traffic, the drink problem had been removed by GOD, thank you very much but I was still doing things My Way, I had only done the ist half of the 1st step. I was still carrying all the baggage of my past which was keeping from the sunlight of the spirit I finally realized that either I had to depend on HIM or else I was going to die, he then in his infinite wisdom put people in my life who guided me through the book where the clear cut directions are.
Member: Bikerbabe
Location: ,,
Date: 25 May 2003
Time: 20:45:03
Me and another friend of mine who still goes to meetings:" are in agreement that this problem is a mental illness. She gets fought on the issue by other members when she talks about it all the time at the meetings if you can believe that. But My very first baby step came for me the day i realized "HEY!" The obbsessions gone! .... I will never forget that feeling of freedom from the bondage of myself..and the mental illness i suffered from continuing a behaviour that was going to finish me... not that my life is so important... but i want to live. ((i's a scarded to die because of my own one human being feeling....aaawwwwwwww
Member: PerryW
Location: Mideast
Date: 26 May 2003
Time: 01:57:58
I know that I have a real problem my wife tells me all the time. She worries about me too much. Why does she worry so much. I want to change things so she wont worry anymore. I am sick and I know that. Listening to others talk and tell their stories helps me. PW
Member: Carrie
Location: Los Angeles
Date: 26 May 2003
Time: 05:07:54
Perry, why dont you check out AA and your wife can check out Alanon?
Member: L-RAY
Location: SCOTLAND
Date: 26 May 2003
Time: 05:31:18
((((Perry)))) lift the phone buddy phone A.A. and make contacts best of luck! I came to believe that there was something that would change me and make life better i was only asked to believe so-- i first -admitted-believed- and being convinced i was at step three! have a nice day L-RAY
Member: Lydia
Location: Border Town
Date: 26 May 2003
Time: 07:00:13
Perry, pray for your wife. Pray that she doesn't worry about you. Pray that she is at ease regarding your problem. Pray that she understands that she can't solve your problem and that she turns it over to God and leaves it up to God. Pray that she sleeps well and takes good care of herself. Pray that she feels good and cheerful and doesn't think your problems are her fault. Even if you don't really mean it just do it, PRAY, and then you won't feel guilty about your wife getting gray hairs. Try this for a couple of weeks, whenever you think about it. See if it helps you. It helped me.
Member: Cec H
Location: Cowtown
Date: 26 May 2003
Time: 14:12:52
Hi all Cec H alkie here. I didn't believe that a Higher Power could keep me sober. I saw others in the program that where happy and sober, but I keep getting drunk. I was two months sober and fighting the demons, when I was picked up by the Police and interagated for 5 hours as a robbery suspect. After they where done with me, they cut me lose. The first thought that came to mind was, God I need a drink, The second thought that came to mind was, OH Please, God donn't let me. I remember leaving the Police station and that's it, I donn't remember the 12 block walk home or the half a dozen bars I had to pass. I came to in my apartment living room and I was sober. That's when I started to believe that this Higher Power/God, could do for me what I could not do for myself. All I had to do was be Honest in asking.
Member: Brian C.
Location: Sherman, CT
Date: 27 May 2003
Time: 07:56:25
Hi Brian Alcoholic here. When I first came into the program, i thought that the insanity of the 2nd step meant the crazy things I did when drunk. But an old timer enlightened me when he told me about doing things (drinking) over and over again and expecting different results-which never happened. I just kept getting into trouble. I grew up in Ireland and moved to the US 14 years ago (geographic cure) but only lasted a year and by the grace of god, got sober. Luckily for me I was terrified to drink again and a good group and sponsor showed me through the steps to get sober. My relationship with my HP has been changing all the time but here is right here with me always, holding me hand through every situation life brings. He wants me to be happy joyous and free - which, when I look back at where I came from is exactly where I am.
Member: AnilG
Location: Mt Vernon,IL
Date: 27 May 2003
Time: 08:04:45
I am an alcoholic step 2 a power greater then ourselves can restore us from our insanity.that is true I did not believe in GOD first after I hit my bottom I had no place to turn to that is when i was introduced to aa and I reliezed that indeed there is something called higher power which does exist it did for me. I know as long as have faith in my higher power it will the only answer to my insanity. thanks to aa alanon.
Member: Mike C.
Location: San Francisco, CA
Date: 27 May 2003
Time: 08:36:35
Hello, friends! The second step for me is one I must repeat several times a day. As I became more spiritual I found steps one two and three need to be done on a daily basis. Step two begins my closeness to HP. When I first got to AA I thought it was only a redundant statement, one already addressed by step three. But they are separate, I am beginning to see. Keep Sober
Member: Mark
Location: NY
Date: 27 May 2003
Time: 09:08:46
Well, why not, eh? I haven't shared on this one this week so here goes gang I'm sure it'll be a hit just like my other non-AA-conformist ideas! I already knew then(7 1/2 years ago) that God could do ANYTHING so I certainly have never had any problem with that idea. My problem was at the time the semantics involved with "sanity." I now look back at it and get a big kick out of the fact I actually bought the idea that I was "insane." That is just plain stupid! Hey, I know most alkies have some other mental, emotional, psychological, and even physical problems to go along with their lovely addiction. Me personally I'm just blessed to NOT be one of the many, that's all. I obviously did a few things that were not what most "sane" people do, but that didn't make me "insane"!! Also just plain dumb to think that. Anyways, today I jsut love God, know He can do Anything, and have no need to any longer evencontemplate whether or not I'm crazy, I'm not and it would only be a cop-out for me to use that ideaology to diminish my personal responsibility if/when I do things that are "abnormal" per the standards of the society in which I live. You see, I/we can play semantic word games all day long, what it comes down to for me is loving God beyond my wildest dreams of standard human love. That's what I strive for, and the rest, well it just falls into place if I keep the focus on God and think, then act proportionately. Not perfect yet, but I'm darn sure striving for it!!!!!!!!!!
Member: Sarah
Location: NW USA
Date: 27 May 2003
Time: 16:01:00
Hi, my name is Sarah and I am a recovering alcoholic. I would like to share my experience, strength and hope about the second step of this 'spiritual program' ... 'came to believe that a power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity'. I have gone to A.A. meetings, they talked of their insanity, I have gone to N.A. meetings, they talked of their insanity, I have gone to O.A. meetings, they talked of their insanity, I have gone to ACOA meetings, they talked of their insanity. Thanks, one and all for sharing your experience, strength and hope ... it has taught me a 'global view greater than my 'EGO ... Edging God Out' It helps me to stay sober in these days ... 'full of fear, full of spiritual insanity'
Member: day day day
Location: chay chay chay
Date: 27 May 2003
Time: 16:56:32
"Came to believe that a power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity" Yes there is much insanity in the world to day, insomuch so that it'll drive you to drink, or, drive you to quit drinking, and, above all, we have a soul to consider, and so seldem do we consider it in such a hustle and bustle society that that nudge from the judge is only second to that nudge from God!..
Member: DaveC
Location: England
Date: 27 May 2003
Time: 18:27:07
Took me a long time to get over this self imposed hurdle. I didn't have to believe in God or anything. All I needed was a 'sneaking suspicion that perhaps there was a power greater than me'. I heard this on the AA tapes with Joe McQ. (My sponsor gave me the tapes) I was home and dry (sober lol) after that.........
Member: tech
Location:
Date: 27 May 2003
Time: 18:30:40
Please everyone accept my abject apologies. The last Sunday of the month the subject is supposed to be on one of the traditions. This tech misread the calendar and thought the last Sunday of the month was next Sunday. To everyone who was looking forward to discussing a tradition this week-I'm very, very sorry.
Member: Bikerbabe
Location: To the techs
Date: 28 May 2003
Time: 04:45:44
Ive been meaning to say thankyou to the techs and whoever or whatever else is making this all happen...sincerely. so thanx: if it wasn't for you ide have to go to f2f meetings. On another note... ((yu know))... i was just telling my buddy Mark that i want to start a nail-bitters anonymous group. Do you think one day i will be as popular as "billy dubulya and "doc bobby? Maybe i could even wear a pointy hat to single me out as most high? Mark? whatchathink? bikerbabes live and kickin it at OMG... 2 oclock in the am! good nite for pete's sakes... hey where did that saying originate from?
Member: T-Bone
Location: S. Fl.
Date: 28 May 2003
Time: 05:51:27
Mark, thanks for your share, but, let me ask you something. You say the use of the word insanity as well as other comments from the big book are semantics. Then you say that you "were not insane you were just dumb". Help me with the semantics of that? The definiation of insanity is doing the same things over and over again expecting differernt results. Insert dumb for insane and it fits just as well. Oh well, semantics are just a matter of opinion, or are they?
Member: Craig L (Dogmanor@yahoo.com)
Location: Aloha, Oregon
Date: 28 May 2003
Time: 10:39:04
When I was new to AA, I was way to smart for this higher power stuff. Then it was suggested I use the group. Right!! a room full of brain damaged pathological liars. Bottom line I was/am terrified of drinking again, so I did what I was told. I had little energy left to fight. Over several days now and learning the practice of the 12 steps, my faith has deepened. Out of that room of losers, I found many who understand me without much discussion. When we look each other in the eyes, I know God is looking back. I can rely all that presences to keep me sober today.
Member: Mark
Location: Albany-Special for T
Date: 28 May 2003
Time: 16:15:40
T-Bone my friend, that's a nice try, but that's NOT what I said nor can your argument even actually apply as the premise is mistaken with an incorrect definition of insanity in the first place. I do however have deep appreciation for the fact that your at least obviously thinking, that's very encouraging and I thank you comrade, nice!!
Member: Mike H.
Location: Jackson MI
Date: 28 May 2003
Time: 16:44:28
I tried for years to stop drinking on my own. I wanted to be in control. In other words, I wanted to play God. What I found out is that there is only one God and I'm not it. Insanity for me is doing the same things expecting different results. Sanity to me is doing it right the first time. I do that now through the help of God, friends, AA program, and the fellowship. All we need is to believe and it gets better as time goes on. Thanks for letting me share.
Member: Bikerbabe
Location: Hellishelping
Date: 29 May 2003
Time: 00:39:59
((IMAGINE: GETTING HIGH ON YOUR HORSE... WHEN YOU'VE STOLEN IT IN THE FIRST PLACE)).... isn't that just sooo alcoholic? I'm glad i have the humility today to realize that there was nothing admirable about "not being able to cut it in the real world, because of my "Living problem... caused by my "Drinking problem. I am an alcoholic and i deal with it using the program and all kinds of other stuff and i am especially grateful that i no longer attend meetings as i would have probably drank again.. (ps.. that is not a suggestion for newcomers)) I ask god "if it is his will for me that i never ever think i'm something special for that... but i am special for other things and that's okay. Gee wiz... i was puking, but i was still so proud...
Member: RE
Location: Chicago
Date: 29 May 2003
Time: 01:11:32
Im new to the AA program. Well not so new. I went to a couple meetings years ago but stopped drinking for a year and 1/2 due to pregnancy. I hoped my alcoholism would go away naturally but I guess I never really addressed the problem. I know step 1 is true for me and now im stuck in step 2 trying to get rid of the hopeless feeling and finding something else worthwile to live for besides alcohol/drugs. Craig made me really laugh because I am kind of ashamed going to meetings and hanging with "losers" but I know thats a wrong label and I know they could really grow on me if I keep going.
Member: Jen G
Location: NJ
Date: 29 May 2003
Time: 07:52:30
Craig, Thanks for your share. Liked the line, "When we look each other in the eyes, I know God is looking back." Great way to explain the concept of a higher power--for me, at least.
Member: Steve H
Location: New South Wales, Australia
Date: 29 May 2003
Time: 17:54:56
The word "could" in the Step was very important to me. It gave me hope that things could improve with spiritual help.If the wording had been "would", my disease would have said, "That's a promise." I didn't trust anyone or anything.Therefore, I would have possibly kept away from A.A. Over the years, the Hope in Step 2 has become reality, thanks to my Higher Power, the A.A. programme, the people at MEETINGS and a lot of hard, but rewarding, personal effort.
Member: Bill H.
Location: Ellwood City, Pa
Date: 30 May 2003
Time: 02:10:38
Bill H./Grateful Recovering Alcoholic; Sobriety Date: 4-30-91: I truly believe that "AA" is a God Given and Sometimes with a sense of humor God Guided Program. I choose to call my Higher Power "GUS" which stands for "The Guy Up Stairs". I was raised a Catholic and I remember that when I made my First Holy Communion, which happened late for me, I was in fifth grade. I felt really close to Jesus. Just for that one day I felt really filled by a spirit that I had never felt before. I never really thought about that feeling much after that day until I camae into the rooms of AA. I remember the day that I got on my knees and asked God to take away my desire for drinking. I had reached my bottom, fotunately not as low as some of our members had to go before they found the rooms. I have not even wanted a drink since that day in May of 1991. I know that it was something Much Greater than Myself that took away the desire to drink because I had tried on my own numerous time before this and had only been able to manage a few month at best without a drink, usually less than a week. I have also, after about a year sober, tried to quit smoking. I have had periods of up to six months without smoking but it has been a struggle just like I hear some of our memnbers talk about with the drinking craving. I believe that although other recovery programs are based on the AA Principles, Steps, and Traditions, I honestly feel that AA is the only God Given Recovery Program. I don't think that I did anything differently when I thought I asked my higher power to take away my desire for smoking, but the results have been much different. I think that God choose the drunk in the gutter to show the world that there really is a "God". What better way to show mankind than by taking drunks laying there in our puke and make us upstanding, trustworthy, devoted husband, father, friend, and fellow worker again. What more proof is needed that there is a power greater than ourself. The results of that miracle is evident in countless recovered drunks as visualized by the real world on a daily basis. A power greater than ourselves, "You Bet Ya"
Member: Kathy K.
Location: Northeast
Date: 30 May 2003
Time: 04:46:04
TECH - You're forgiven!!!!
Member: T-Bone
Location: S. Fl.
Date: 30 May 2003
Time: 06:17:00
Mark, Thanks for setting me straight, I try my best with my limited capabilities. Peace brother. How's that for humble, you self centered prick. LOL. Actually if I miss interpreted your post I apoligize.
Member: Mark
Location: NY
Date: 30 May 2003
Time: 11:25:21
T-Bone my friend, your alright! I don't know that you totally misinterpreted it, you got the basic general gist of it I think. Yet your canned AA comeback is while slightly humorous, actually more to the point that basically anyone who goes to AA for a solid year is going to believe the brainwashed lines of force-fed regurgitation that are all too common in the rooms. That is just part of our human nature my man, we are all susceptible to it. It's called fundamental attribution error and it's a trait of all human beings, NOT just alcoholics! So welcome to humanity my friend, your wayyyyy more than just an alkie whether you like it or not, just like me!!!!!!!!!!
Member: LOIS R
Location: windy city
Date: 30 May 2003
Time: 12:34:20
Hi I'm Lois grateful to be talking to people of A.A. I thank GOD ALMIGHTY for another day sober. Step 2 is a great step, it was a rule of awaking for me I dont have to take charge any more. Came to belive in a power grater than myself Beliving keep me sober. My power was the people in the meeting until I found out people can fail you . So I needed something strong that didnt break, sleep, lie.....and that when i came to belive in a POWER grater than myself try it. Because self cant do it self kept me drunk and insane. Peace is power k.c.b. Thank for listing.
Member: Melanie
Location: Akron, Ohio, USA
Date: 30 May 2003
Time: 12:52:20
Hello, friends. I'm Melanie, an alcoholic. To me, "insanity," as spoken of in Step 2, is not the clinical type of insanity as diagnosed by doctors. Insanity was manifested by my inability to live according to my own moral values. My constant lying, stealing, promiscuity, squandering of time and money...these are just a few of the activities that caused me daily, painful remorse. I knew that these actions were intimately linked with my alcohol use, yet I couldn't accumulate more than a couple of sober days at a stretch. I was living at odds with myself. Add to this the night terrors, depression, paranoia and anxiety attacks and you have a picture of the insanity that ruled my drunken life. I received the Big Book before I stopped drinking. I read that book repeatedly. It spoke to me.(PRE-indoctrination) I found it to be true that I couldn't stop on my own power. I turned to the medical community.(HP#1 for me). I was dried out and sent to counseling and A.A. Rats!! I thought I could get around the A.A. angle! Well, I was beaten into submission, so I went.(HP#2) I was taught in A.A. to pray. Work the steps. The people in the rooms of A.A. taught me to find God.(current HP) I learned to live in harmony with God and myself. I no longer suffer from remorse, anxiety, nightmares or any of the other symptoms I have listed above. I am far from perfect, but now I have the inner peace that comes from a sober life, lived according to the suggestions of the 12 Steps. I may have been brainwashed at some point, but that's alright with me. Love and Peace to You!
Member: mark c
Location: west memphis, ar
Date: 30 May 2003
Time: 19:51:52
Hello, I'm Mark an alcoholic. I have to keep this simple for it to work for me. When I kept going and spending my money on alcohol and expecting it to provide me the solutions to my problems, I was insane in regards to the first drink and every one that came after that point.Abstenance started me on the journey of believing my home group's God loved me. My sponsor told me to ask Him in the morning and thank Him at night. It still works, it really does.
Member: Dennis D.
Location: Fort Worth, Texas
Date: 30 May 2003
Time: 23:54:43
INSANITY IS DRINKING AGAINST YOUR OWN WILL. "Restored to sanity" is having the obsession to drink (against your own will) removed. "An alcoholic is a person who suffers from an overwhelming obsession of the mind that compells them to drink against their own will, coupled with an allergy of the body that condems them to go mad or die" Bill Wilson.
Member: RE
Location: Chicago
Date: 31 May 2003
Time: 03:14:15
I checked back here and want you to know you helped me. Melanie, I had my first panic attack last week and your experience gives me hope. Also that sanity=not drinking against your own will and having that overwhelming obsession REMOVED!
Member: John K
Location: Philadelphia
Date: 31 May 2003
Time: 11:27:59
Okay--go ahead and try it your way. Let us know how it turns out. Good luck and congratulations. Best wishes. Who says the program is logical? Who says God is rational? The central question for every alcoholic is, "who the hell do you think you are?" These things cannot be judged by human (especially too-smart alcoholic) standards. "Few indeed are the practicing alcoholics who have any idea how irrational they are, or seeing their irrationality, can bear to face it. Some will be willing to term themselves "problem drinkers", but cannot endure the suggestion that they are IN FACT mentally ill." (12x12 pp 32-33) Out-thinking alcohol is impossible for the alcoholic mind. Just because I am insane doesn't mean I am not accountable for my actions; the difference is that today I have spiritual principles to use (in place of my own ideas) in everyday life-This is the only reason I mainly stay out of trouble today. As long as I utilize these principles, I APPPEAR sane; if I ever stop doing what I am doing, I will eventually return to alcohol. "these are the facts out of our experience." The only brainwashing going on in AA is the bullshit about what you can and cannot share, self-love, pop psychology, and things that are not about the program. The problem for the newcomer is to be willing enough to go to any lengths to find out the truth about the problem and about AA's solution to it, so the newcomer can make an honest, informed choice about whether or not to use the program. The real problem is finding people who not only know the program but are willing to speak out. In my opinion, the Fellowship may be human and flawed, but the Program is perfect and simply works. If it no longer holds appeal for you, why are you here? If you really want to be a rebel, get a real relationship with God, then tell everyone about it. That'll separate your friends from everyone else in a heartbeat in AA.
Member: Mark
Location: NY
Date: 31 May 2003
Time: 12:52:36
Johnny Boy from Philly, so sweet and knowledgable of what AA really is, a few simple question for ya pal, ready? Here goes it......... Who says God is rational? Who says He isn't? Who do I think I am? Who do you think you are? Do I get to decide what God is and isn't? Oh, of course not, because apparently YOU do!!! How silly of me to think I could have my own God, or is He the God of ALL, including you? No my friend, you may not be brain(washed), but it sure sounds like you could use at least a little "dusting." Hey, listen my man, I am all about God, but your false account of not only others motives as if you know like you are in fact God is not too appealing and arrogant at best. If you think AA is perfect, you are at a minimum in the rinse cycle and they're just not through with ya yet. Just keep going back and they'll eventually finish off the job or you will turn to the real and true God not of "not drinking," but of ALL my friend, ALL!!!!!!!! Don't worry, my way is the way of God and you aren't Him and can't tell me nor anyone else what they're way and path to the real God is. Should you think you have that power than yeah, you are mentally ill, as for me I'm not mentally ill nor do I force my will as God's will, I at least recognize I don't have that power. I do love your enthusiasm and thought though, very admirable. A little awash with AA jargon, but somewhat insightfull nonetheless and definitely appreciated. Now what?? You do what you want right?? And I do what I think God wants me to do, NOT what you think God wants me to do. How's that sound old buddy, work for you????????
Member: Kathy F.
Location: Texas
Date: 31 May 2003
Time: 13:13:14
When I came to AA this last time, I was scared to appoint a higher power because I had been in AA twice before and used a religious god as my higher power. My problem here was that I had changed my religious affiliations several times in search of the "right" god. When the oldtimers suggested I take the path of agnostics in AA I became indignant. I was told that I had confused religion and spirituality and that if I wanted to sober up and stay sober I needed to move on with the steps. So, we settled on "believe that we believe". This carried me a long way. My sponsor, who recently passed on, would often say to me: "This is where your insanity comes in". I'd go nuts when she said it! It took me years to realize that she was teaching me to identify my thinking processes which produced no positive result. In the first year of my sobriety, there was a guy who was smitten with the word "clarity" and he used to drive me crazy too. Now I get it.
Member: Carlc
Location: NM
Date: 31 May 2003
Time: 18:09:48
Some of Websters definitions of insanity are, a mental disorder, or a something utterly foolish or unreasonable. Getting drunk, getting beat up, going to jail, getting divorced more than once, getting fired all the time, wrecking cars,and on and on and on were just part of what I did when drunk, but the worst part of this mental disorder was the people that I had harmed, I get absolutly nauseated in AA meeting when I hear all this self pity, self delusion, and just plain fucking whining, about how we have been wronged,and what people did to us. I was running around playing big shot in the bars in a nice Cadilac , drinking Crown Royal, and being a big ass phony, and my wife and children were on welfare, and I had the audacity to call her a whore, and if she would have it would only be to feed my child. Then I come into aa and I got all this cuddling and let us love you untill you can learn to love yourself and the rest of the bullshit that almost got me dead. It wasnt I took responsibilty for my actions and looked to this higher power and did the rest of the action did HE relieve me of this insanity. One of the definitions for sane is to be of sound mind. We are trying to love and sponsor, and cuddle and bullshit people into sanity.
Member: JJS
Location: calgary
Date: 01 Jun 2003
Time: 04:39:42
i come to meetings and i hear people talk about everything. Ihear people talk about the good stuff and the bad. i hear good people talk about sick stuff and i hear sick people talk about good stuff. i hear people complain about their day and i hear people carry the message. can you imagine going to a meeting and hear people talk about nothing.............Thats Step 2 we had to fearlessly face the proposioin that God is either everthing or else He is nothing. God either is, or He isn't. what will be our choice? stoddarts@shaw.ca And i never have to be alone again.
Member: Vee
Location: midwest
Date: 01 Jun 2003
Time: 06:14:22
John K. maybe take a break from your sponsor for a while. Get another and see how it goes. You might be just a bit what they call co-dependent. A little detachment (emotional distance) might be good for a while anyway. Just a suggestion like all the rest. Thanks. Keep coming back.
Member: Heather
Location: home and sober
Date: 01 Jun 2003
Time: 06:15:36
Welcome to all. A Power greater than myself has restored me to a semblance of sanity. Nothing else could or would have. I, too, like the quote about seeing God in another's eyes. God uses people to work many of his miracles. I'm grateful for the miracle of AA and for the miracle that God could love or care about me. That gives me hope and courage to keep trying. He accepts and approves of even the smallest improvement to myself. He has infinite time and patience, lucky for me.
Member: Vee
Location: midwest
Date: 01 Jun 2003
Time: 06:23:45
I dig that my HP only has to be a power greater than me, just me, not you guys. I read that reason will take you so far but faith is limitless, and that means faith in my toothpaste or faith in my fellows, or faith in my HP. I'll hush, keep listening, and take it from there.