Member:
Location:
Date: May 18, 2003
Time: 06:16 AM

Comments

Don't try to explain aa to yourself, or anyone else for that matter, if it works don't worry because aa will reveal itself in many different ways at many different times. Sounds like a few of you need to attend some meetings. I know I do after reading some these post. Watch out cause the ego is a powerful thing, and left to itself would have us out drinking with the idea that we are in control of our drinking etc. Yes I do have some resentments but Im trying to take care of them one day at a time. Thanks, Love one another meg


Member: xx
Location:
Date: May 18, 2003
Time: 08:38 AM

Comments

xx


Member: Linda C
Location: Pittsburgh
Date: May 18, 2003
Time: 08:43 AM

Comments

Good morning. Linda C here. Day 2 (again!) and I discovered that we have an Overcomers group at my church, so I will be going there to be among people who hold the same religous beliefs as I do. I thank you all sincerely for being here. Peace.


Member: Patty B
Location: austin
Date: May 18, 2003
Time: 09:44 AM

Comments

Hey, Patty from Austin TX here. Fending off loneliness? Hmm. Well I go to a meeting almost every day where people in the room got up out of their chairs and came and hugged me and welcomed me and introduced themselves. I try to also greet newcomers at meetings, although I'm only on day 25. I have to be careful with feelings of loneliness, because if I don't work my steps and do my meditations I can either sit and wallow in it, feeling like I'm the only one with this problem or I can go the other direction and want to go meet someone to start a relationship with that would be completely inappropriate for me at this time. I've had sooo many screwed up relationships because I settled for the first one who showed me attention or I went after someone with worse addictions than me because he seemed exciting. Sheesh. For today, when I feel lonely, I get out my literature and read, make a call to either my sponsor or someone else in the program or get online here and read and share! Thanks to this great resource I don't have to feel like I'm alone. That's all I've got today. Thanks for the topic and the shares. Patty


Member: Mike J
Location: Oregon
Date: May 18, 2003
Time: 11:16 AM

Comments

24 hours. After a 10 year slip. Not doing too good right now. Much has changed in my life over those 10 years. I thought I was "better." Ego took hold. I was about four years sober, then had just "one." Kept it level for a long time. Went to a meeting yesterday. I'm going again today. Mike


Member: Terry
Location: NY
Date: May 18, 2003
Time: 11:34 AM

Comments

Good morning everybody. Mike J. and Linda C. I really relate to both of you. I was sober 4 days then had some drinks this week-end. Woke up with a headache today. My problem is that I am ambivelent about quitting right now because I have a long vacation coming up in about 5 weeks and I just can't picture it without at least some alcohol. I know I am fooling myself if I think I can control my intake because I seldom am able to but I just don't know if I am mentally ready to quit right now. I know if that's my attitude then I really don't belong on this website along side those of you who are going to meetings and really giving it your best shot. But thanks for letting me vent anyway. Can't really address this week's topic since I have very little alone time and actually wouldn't mind a bit more of it.


Member: Diane
Location: Oklahoma
Date: May 18, 2003
Time: 12:08 PM

Comments

Diane here on day 54, loneliness well I've had my share of that subject and I do work on it, I've been taking care of the children for the past two weeks so was wanting some quiet time, now I'm back in my quiet Home and my computer and some time to work this program, you know before late at night when I chose to drink it did not help aloneness at all, it only made my problems much worse but we viewed our booze as our friend so this may be why the disease does hit more on people who are alone or maybe not, I am unsure at this point, I only know I'm sober and very happy in my life now, I still have my hubby drinking which does upset me when he gets that drunk attitude on me and then I just say to him ((( have another shot))) then he leaves me alone


Member: Cheri
Location: Ca
Date: May 18, 2003
Time: 12:20 PM

Comments

terri, mike, linda, I understand completely the slips, was on 14 days thought I could have a cold beer, its been real hot here,(excuse) and drank more than I wanted as usual. I used to beat myself up and feel guilty when I slip, now I forgive myself and get back to this site. I ask God to forgive my weakness and just for today try not to drink. My tough time is 5pm. Habit, being alone at this time, wanting to relax, whatever.....and I take the first drink, which leads to more. Need to find a meeting at this time of the day to NOT be alone. Thanks for being here. Cheri


Member: L-RAY
Location: SCOTLAND
Date: May 18, 2003
Time: 01:18 PM

Comments

Loneliness- it was hard for me ever to fit in and sometimes i felt lonley in a crowded room! but when i was told that i was no longer alone "it felt good to be wanted" it was a big effort for me in the begining -but i had the desire to feel wanted and i was fed up being alone especialy inside my head! so that was 16+ years ago and life has got better and to-day im not lonley anymore- so dont be lonley lift the phone-and get to meets- REGARDS L-RAY


Member: Diane
Location: Oklahoma
Date: May 18, 2003
Time: 02:23 PM

Comments

thank you L-Ray it is nice for a change to read from a member of AA who has lasted a long time on the program we can always use encouragement and good advice from you and any others that come on this site. Hey ((((Marsha L))))) I am again looking for you???? I miss your post


Member: Kathleen
Location: Florida
Date: May 18, 2003
Time: 03:38 PM

Comments

Hi Everyone, Kathleen here alcoholic. I no longer feel alone anymore after being in the program awhile and incorperating the steps in my life. That didn't happen though until through unseen life events beyond my control kinda forced me to be alone with myself. Now I choose to be alone as I finally learned to like myself some and the family of AA ers is just wonderful. I used to beleive that I couldn't be happy unless I had a man in my life. I thought sex was love. I learned otherwise and am soooooo very grateful to the program and ya'll. Keep coming back.


Member: John K
Location: Philadelphia
Date: May 18, 2003
Time: 04:03 PM

Comments

Hi all, John, alcoholic. I don't remember the last time I was truly lonely in AA. I was certainly besieged before AA. I used to be in the Navy, and I was stationed aboard an aircraft carrier, which is the biggest type of military ship afloat and can house over 5,000 people. I was lonely even there! For me, the loneliness mostly went away almost immediately after I joined AA, and has been eradicated ever since I started having a relationship with God. My relationship with God is the only one that lasts and for me is the ultimate loneliness cure. No matter how many meetings I attend or how close I am to the human beings in my groups, there will (has) come a day when I was or will be all by myself with no one to turn to but God. If I don't have a reliable relationship with my HP(God) by then, I will at best suffer and at worst drink. I am so comfortable now, it's amazing! It's one of the best things about AA for me. Also, I have always had plenty of phone numbers with me. The question is, what am I gonna do when all else fails?


Member: Tom G.
Location: Saginaw
Date: May 18, 2003
Time: 05:09 PM

Comments

Tom here, alcoholic. I can be lonely in a crowded room. I can have what seems like a separate existence in my own head. When I first came in the Program, the fellowship rocketed me outside myself and into a new existence, one that relieved me of that terrible separation, but over time that feeling has edged its way back into my life sometimes. My relationship with God, or a notion of God, began during a cocaine trip one night in Maui, and as a result I don't have what I consider a real healthy relationship with a loving God. But the experience did give me a certain belief, or kept me open to the possibility of the existence of a Supreme Being. At least I'm over the burning sensation that I am that Being. That being the self-centered, ego-maniac with a inferiority complex. AA has saved my life, at least it has been the linchpin that everything else has hinged upon. I honestly don't think I 'll ever completely shake the Maui experience, but I can stay sober by the grace of God. Some days are better emotionally than others, but the fellowship of AA continues to do for me what I can not do for myself. And hope is alive in my life. Everything depends on my growth in the Program- including this website. I have phone numbers, I just choose not to use them. When I was in Dayton, Ohio, one of my sponsors had 50+ years in the program, so even with my 13+ years, I'm in early sobriety. That's reason to keep coming back! God bless


Member: Tom G.
Location: Saginaw
Date: May 18, 2003
Time: 05:09 PM

Comments

Tom here, alcoholic. I can be lonely in a crowded room. I can have what seems like a separate existence in my own head. When I first came in the Program, the fellowship rocketed me outside myself and into a new existence, one that relieved me of that terrible separation, but over time that feeling has edged its way back into my life sometimes. My relationship with God, or a notion of God, began during a cocaine trip one night in Maui, and as a result I don't have what I consider a real healthy relationship with a loving God. But the experience did give me a certain belief, or kept me open to the possibility of the existence of a Supreme Being. At least I'm over the burning sensation that I am that Being. That being the self-centered, ego-maniac with a inferiority complex. AA has saved my life, at least it has been the linchpin that everything else has hinged upon. I honestly don't think I 'll ever completely shake the Maui experience, but I can stay sober by the grace of God. Some days are better emotionally than others, but the fellowship of AA continues to do for me what I can not do for myself. And hope is alive in my life. Everything depends on my growth in the Program- including this website. I have phone numbers, I just choose not to use them. When I was in Dayton, Ohio, one of my sponsors had 50+ years in the program, so even with my 13+ years, I'm in early sobriety. That's reason to keep coming back! God bless


Member: Tom G.
Location: Saginaw
Date: May 18, 2003
Time: 05:09 PM

Comments

Tom here, alcoholic. I can be lonely in a crowded room. I can have what seems like a separate existence in my own head. When I first came in the Program, the fellowship rocketed me outside myself and into a new existence, one that relieved me of that terrible separation, but over time that feeling has edged its way back into my life sometimes. My relationship with God, or a notion of God, began during a cocaine trip one night in Maui, and as a result I don't have what I consider a real healthy relationship with a loving God. But the experience did give me a certain belief, or kept me open to the possibility of the existence of a Supreme Being. At least I'm over the burning sensation that I am that Being. That being the self-centered, ego-maniac with a inferiority complex. AA has saved my life, at least it has been the linchpin that everything else has hinged upon. I honestly don't think I 'll ever completely shake the Maui experience, but I can stay sober by the grace of God. Some days are better emotionally than others, but the fellowship of AA continues to do for me what I can not do for myself. And hope is alive in my life. Everything depends on my growth in the Program- including this website. I have phone numbers, I just choose not to use them. When I was in Dayton, Ohio, one of my sponsors had 50+ years in the program, so even with my 13+ years, I'm in early sobriety. That's reason to keep coming back! God bless


Member: Tom G.
Location: Michign aginaw
Date: May 18, 2003
Time: 05:09 PM

Comments

Tom here, alcoholic. I can be lonely in a crowded room. I can have what seems like a separate existence in my own head. When I first came in the Program, the fellowship rocketed me outside myself and into a new existence, one that relieved me of that terrible separation, but over time that feeling has edged its way back into my life sometimes. My relationship with God, or a notion of God, began during a cocaine trip one night in Maui, and as a result I don't have what I consider a real healthy relationship with a loving God. But the experience did give me a certain belief, or kept me open to the possibility of the existence of a Supreme Being. At least I'm over the burning sensation that I am that Being. That being the self-centered, ego-maniac with a inferiority complex. AA has saved my life, at least it has been the linchpin that everything else has hinged upon. I honestly don't think I 'll ever completely shake the Maui experience, but I can stay sober by the grace of God. Some days are better emotionally than others, but the fellowship of AA continues to do for me what I can not do for myself. And hope is alive in my life. Everything depends on my growth in the Program- including this website. I have phone numbers, I just choose not to use them. When I was in Dayton, Ohio, one of my sponsors had 50+ years in the program, so even with my 13+ years, I'm in early sobriety. That's reason to keep coming back! God bless


Member: Duane, P.
Location: Hollywood, CA
Date: May 18, 2003
Time: 07:12 PM

Comments

It is lonely being an alcoholic and perhaps that is why this week's topic is so appropriate. When you are an alcoholic, it seems, the only one who understands your need to drink is you and other alcoholics. By drinking, we are choosing to isolate ourselves from (1) ourselves, (2) others and (3) a normal existence. I am just completing day 14 of sobriety. This is the longest time I have been sober in about 15 years. In all honesty, these past two weeks have been some of the best of my life. Because of drinking, I lost my wife and have spent a good portion of my life being quite lonely (like the topic suggests). Moreover, in an alcoholic daze it is difficult for us to make good decisions and we really never start living. Prior to now, I had tried numerous times to stop drinking. Most of the posts above refer to the fact that certain opportunities constantly present themselves for us to drink and we are likely to slip up at some point in the future. Probably most of us will continue to drink. As alcoholics, we like to drink. However, I believe there is more to it and I really feel that the real problem alcoholics have is physiological and driven by a different brain chemistry. About three weeks ago, after realizing everytime I drank I was likely to black out and do stupid stuff I would hear about in the morning, I decided to do something about it. Alcohol is so, so stupid. Yes, you can have a lot of fun with it; however, ultimately it leads nowhere. I have suffered so much from alcohol and this suffering has been so meaningless. Despite being extremely successful at a young age (due, in large part, to determination) my determination to stop alcohol has not worked. Three weeks ago I researched all I could about alcohol and discovered a new prescription drug called Naltrexone that stops your craving for alcohol. Hands down, this is the best thing that has ever happened in my life and I honestly do not have the need to drink anymore. I have been avoiding most of my drinking friends and, in all honesty, I know that it will be easy to meet new friends that do not drink. I am so looking forward to my new life and really, really believe that this drug will give me that life. I know that a Twelve Step Program may be the best for some people. If you do not have the time for this, though, I cannot urge you strongly enough to see your doctor and get Naltrexone. It works and, frankly, has been a miracle for me.


Member: Kelly M
Location: NH
Date: May 18, 2003
Time: 11:51 PM

Comments

Hi, Kelly an alcoholic. I'm like the AA saying, I'm a loner but I'm never alone. Well, unless by choice and that has not been much since I quit drinking last October. I have always been a loner since I was a kid but it felt right for me. I liked my own company and going for walks in the woods or hiking or swimming etc. I was not a leader or a follower but an independent/ neutral type. I became a hermit when I went over the waterfall into full blown alcoholism. I lost hope and gave up on life. To be perfectly honest people ruined my buzz so I stayed away from them. Men did to so I didn't date. I was perfectly happy, just me and my bottle... Add lyrics ;) Of course like any good love affair it had to come to an end. It wasn't sad because I was done in my mind for a year before I quit. Kind of like preparing for a imminent and much needed divorce. I no longer want to isolate since I surrendered to alcoholism. I like sober people and have many new friends in AA. I am as busy as I want to be with my sober life and in AA. I still like my alone time but it is a healthy balance. I will always be an independent woman as long as I remember that dependence on a higher power is not a weakness but a strength. I can't, he can I think I'll let him. Kelly


Member: tawni.o
Location: mobile,al
Date: May 19, 2003
Time: 12:02 AM

Comments

hi.i am new to all of this. i am 4 months clean.I just got out of rehab last week. But being inside the rooms of a.a. has taught me alot about myself. I hit my rock bottom pretty hard. The big book talks about jails, institutions or death, well i had to experience 2 of the above before i realized that i was powerless over my addiction. I was court orderd to rehab. I feel like the weight of the world was lifted when worked step 3.make a decision to tun our will and our lives over to the care of god. That is my higher power. And by the grace of god i am sober for today. I know i can only take it one day at a time and thats what i plan to do. thank you .


Member: Carlc
Location: Texas
Date: May 19, 2003
Time: 02:42 AM

Comments

The reason I always went back to drinking wasnt the fact that I was lonely it was that I was restless irratable and discontent. I made up a lot of excuses one of which was loneliness but the truth of the matter was that selfishness and selfcenterdness was the root of my problem I am not much but thats all I ever thought about how in the world was I going to have a relationship with anyone when I had alienated everyone around me. The steps,and a relationship with my creator and have made me a free man.


Member: Kelly M
Location: NH
Date: May 19, 2003
Time: 07:08 AM

Comments

Hi (Carlc) Amen to that. Alienation is so characteristic of alcoholics. Then we wonder why we are alone! To Everyone here, lets just stay sober today no matter what and enjoy the day as it is a gift. Kelly


Member: Marsha L
Location: Michigan
Date: May 19, 2003
Time: 07:58 AM

Comments

Good morning--(Hi Diane) I have been reading the posts and somewhat depressed but still sober. I remember feeling lonely since I was a child and I have a brother and sisters of whom I am close in age so I have to say that my lonliness stems from some kind of physical imbalance. I can remember feeling this way since I was about 7 years old. I always looked for people or things to satisfy an urge that I couldn't even identify. Now as I get older, my perceptions are changing and I really want to stay sober and to experience even lonliness and to be able to honestly sort it out without the cloud of alcohol. Lonliness is a weird concept because you are never truly alone. I think that isolation from self like Duane said is quite accurate.


Member: T-Bone
Location: Fl
Date: May 19, 2003
Time: 09:45 AM

Comments

John K.. Great share. Thanks Duane, Naltrexone, won't welcome you at the door, won't listen to you at night, won't pray with you in the morning and most of all won't understand why you are feeling the way you are feeling. But, whatever floats your boat. What was that? oh yeah, half measures availed us nothing. Thanks for the stock tip anyway.


Member: Tracy V
Location: Essex England
Date: May 19, 2003
Time: 09:55 AM

Comments

The only time i am lonely now is when i skint my eyes to my HP but on days when i stare wide eyed at it (whatever my HP is) i feel so full it wouldn't matter if i was on a desert island. I to like (L-RAY)) use to be along in a crowded room, not no more and all this with only 4months of sobriety great stuff.


Member: Craig L (Dogmanor@yahoo.com)
Location: Aloha, Oregon
Date: May 19, 2003
Time: 11:24 AM

Comments

I can't think my way out of a "wet paper bag". While I was still active, I used to fantasize about having friends and a social life. I regular bars, where I knew most of the faces (at least early in the evening LOL). We often promised to get together to go camping and hiking or some other fun stuff, but then I would wake up and the race was back on to get to my next drink. Even in a crowded bar I was always lonely. Thank God I am off that merry-go-round for today. In recovery I found I have to actually do something to get results. LOL. Early in recovery I went to as many meetings as I could squeeze into the day. Many of them I didn't like and there were many more people there I didn't like. But alcohol was my master and the only defense I had early on was the fellowship of AA. Today I've been on many fun excursions with others in recovery. My day is as full of people as I choose. Even alone, I'm rarely lonely, having found an ever present God in the 12 Steps and the program of AA. Keep coming back!!


Member: Diane
Location: Oklahoma
Date: May 19, 2003
Time: 12:28 PM

Comments

Diane here, alkie day 55 sober, glad to see you back (((Marsha L))) I said I never hardly get lonely but I do find my self lonely at times in my life. My Computer helps a lot and this room, I'm staying sober and each day I notice less of a desire to drink especially since now I have left my stress in Texas hahahaha, I love my Grandchildren but I also realize I am not my Daughters age anymore so she needs to raise them not me, I only need to love them..... I also am a loner type lady and I do enjoy my privacy, glad to be sober...


Member: Bikerbabe
Location: hellishelping
Date: May 19, 2003
Time: 12:44 PM

Comments

Fending off lonliness verses, finding people to suck the life out of "neediness" yesiree.. that's big-un for alkies..One of the toughest lessons i had to learn.. very painful. An oldtimer in aa told me That if i am lonely then i don't have god. At the time it sounded rediculous, and i just didn't get it. I think true lonliness in its proper perspective is a very human experience we all have from time to time. ((But, There's a different kind of lonliness that is pretty sick, and i prefer to call it neediness, (and it is usually found in those who aren't in the bizness of living and doing thier own live's,,(people who are generally more interested in co-dependant relationships, than on keeping the focus where it belongs) Its a nasty place to be, and i swear; ive not met hardly a one new alkie who doesn't have this behaviour. but hey" that's as it should be. It has taken me years to get this one down to a comfortable place... so don't sweat it, it will come, just keep on keepin on.


Member: Carrie
Location: Los Angeles
Date: May 19, 2003
Time: 02:14 PM

Comments

I was lonely, so I drank, which made me feel even more alone, so I had to drink more.... Oh, what a terrible exsistance - nobody knew what I was going through. When people used to ask how my weekend was, I had to put on a smile and say "Great!" - yeah right!! I wanted to die! I was spending weekends drunk and alone in my apartment and going to work everyday with a hangover. What a relief when I finally made it into the rooms of AA. The people there know, they have had the same feelings and experiences, suddenly the world opened up for me. I belonged, I wasn't on the outside looking in anymore. I had some sober friends over the other day, and man - you could NEVER have the kind of conversation we were having, with "normal" people. To be able to be so honest and understood by others like yourself, that is one of the best gifts of this program. Yeah, no pill is ever going to give you that.


Member: Marsha L
Location: Michigan
Date: May 19, 2003
Time: 03:01 PM

Comments

((Bikerbabe I hear you)) My biggest downfall of this addiction was the neediness of the soul. Deep down inside all I wanted was someone to love me and that let me think that "users" loved me. Nothing ever felt right. Then I met a man that was not into partying and of course I spent the first five years of our life-NO TEN-wondering what was wrong with HIM. I have been married to him for 12 years and I think that if not for him I would have never known what a normal relationship might have been like. I had no idea what co-dependant meant until I went to counseling last year and that was the beginning of my journey to sobriety. OH THE FLASHBACKS of prior relationships and what they REALLY meant. Thanks for your post Bikerbabe. (Diane) You are awsome. (Carrie)Don't you hate it when you have to fake happiness. You are right about the pills. I have been there-done that. You have to let substance stop being the crutch. It helps for awhile but just for awhile. I was on antidepressants for quite awhile and that didn't stop the lonliness. Staying sober does.


Member: Robert O
Location: Central New Jersey
Date: May 19, 2003
Time: 03:05 PM

Comments

It's funny how I can be surrounded by a room full of people and still feel like the most lonely person in the world. I don't know why I can't really enjoy the company of others without thinking of everything thats going wrong in my life at the same time. I put up this front that would be hard to challenge. You would never know anything was wrong, but the empty feeling inside is tearing me apart. I don't know why I get this feeling, I almost feel selfish for constantly thinking about what is wrong with me rather then listen to others and enjoy thier company. I don't want to feel this anymore and I could use some help if anyone has gone through the same thing. Still sober but not feeling so great these days. Any response would help. Thanks for you time.


Member: Carrie
Location: Los Angeles
Date: May 19, 2003
Time: 03:19 PM

Comments

I was reffering to the "new prescription drug called Naltrexone that stops your craving for alcohol." Antidepressants and other type drugs are up to the individual person and his/her doctor.


Member: Marsha L
Location: Michigan
Date: May 19, 2003
Time: 03:22 PM

Comments

(Hi Robert) Yes--I know the feeling. Does it feel like you are crippled inside? I know that for years FORTY OF THEM I felt like that. Through experience I noticed that when I did things for other people, I was able to get out of that mode. I still have to work on that.


Member:
Location:
Date: May 19, 2003
Time: 03:43 PM

Comments

culty culty culty. If you're seeking sobriety, and this cult of Bill W doesn't work for you, try http://www.rationalrecovery.com/ http://www.secularsobriety.org/ http://www.aadeprogramming.com/


Member: Diane
Location: Oklahoma
Date: May 19, 2003
Time: 04:23 PM

Comments

hi Diane again, yes Marsha I also did the pills for awhile either uppers or downers then drink about 5 years of that mess, then I finally got off the diet pills and went to booze each night. Now I am happy to report I am now off all forms of pills and the booze and life is so much better when our minds can work without taking drugs of any form, but for those who need certain stuff to help them off the booze that is ok also. what ever works for you but for me I choose to try and be healthy.....


Member: neil s.
Location: suffolk, england
Date: May 19, 2003
Time: 05:57 PM

Comments

hey all, neil here, alcoholic, or like one said, a human being with a problem when i drank, anyhoo, i would not ever pass off that i aand/or anyone else has any or all the answers, if you have read any of my posts, you will know i try to pass on other sites and/or insirational readings for you all to enjoy, so hear goes and is line with this weeks topic : page 83 in the BIG BOOK, read it. happy 24 to us all, just for today I'M not going to drink.


Member:
Location:
Date: May 19, 2003
Time: 08:50 PM

Comments

If any of you would like an AA forum just like this one, but without the disruptions, check this one out http://aaforum.org/12x12/12x12.htm


Member: Patty B
Location: not alone anymore.
Date: May 19, 2003
Time: 11:23 PM

Comments

As if we have no search engine skills? Hey we found this place didn't we? If we don't want to be here we can leave. Good grief. And now..thanks everyone for sharing what it was like, and what it's like now and how you've found the solution. After working step 2 with my sponsor yesterday I found out accidentally that my daughter doesn't "choose to worship God" anymore. Since the first part of our discussion involved her stating "I don't believe in God" and after my calm (well anxious body language and tears but sheesh at least I wasn't screaming at her as I would have when I was in the alcohol..trying to control how she was FEELING or THINKING..as though I have the right or the power to do that? pfft) discussion with her she settled on saying she doesn't choose to worship Him. Doesn't want to go to a different church, likes the church we go to the people and the band..hmm..after a long discussion with someone in another 12 step program I'm in listened to me share this situation, I know now that I'm doing exactly what I'm supposed to be doing. Working the 1st 3 steps. I'm only 26 days sober, but this experience really showed me that isolating about this would never have helped me reach a compromise with her. I didn't beat myself up too much..I still hope and still pray my HP whom I believe is God will help take away some of HER loneliness and show her what a real friend HE can be to all of us. Because one reason I believe she's doubting her faith is because of a friendship she has recently started with an atheist. Man my first instinct was..we're moving, I'm taking you away from that influence, you're not reading any more Anne Rice books, etc. Um..can you say "control freak alcoholic taking her will back"? I knew that you could. Mind blowing that I can give this up..I've only taken it back about 20 times today..but He is still there, I'm so glad He's my friend and I'm not trying to work through my life and my problems by marinating my brain cells in alcohol. Thanks all. (austinheart2003@yahoo.com) Patty


Member: Diane
Location: Oklahoma
Date: May 20, 2003
Time: 12:10 AM

Comments

way to go Patty, we can do it with God on our side and we can also show a good example to our children


Member: 7 yrs
Location: in tibet
Date: May 20, 2003
Time: 01:00 AM

Comments

Awesome Patty.. just be glad your not a Jehova Witness... man they cut off their kin, for not doing it thier way, and consider them doomed and dead! (no kidding) and the stupid thing is that deep down in every man/woman/child is the fundamental idea of god anyhow... so really words are just words, they arent what's really going on.. and they arent the end of your daughters journey now are they? God for someone who is so newly sober, you sound really great, i wish you all the best Patty. KCB


Member: Carlc
Location: Texas
Date: May 20, 2003
Time: 01:08 AM

Comments

To Patty b; will you please explain how you and your sponsor did the 2nd step? I am baffled.


Member: Diane
Location: Oklahoma
Date: May 20, 2003
Time: 10:21 AM

Comments

Fending Off Lonliness, Hi Diane here day 56, Loneliness well if I look to my HP my lonliness will leave, and if I do his will then I won't have negative attitude toward my brothers and sisters or internet alkies, step two ....2. Came to believe that a Power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity that is a good step,,,,


Member: Marsha L
Location: Michigan
Date: May 20, 2003
Time: 11:47 AM

Comments

Hi Everyone--Marsha here. Still sober and feeling great today. I noticed that when I stay happily involved in something even when I am by myself, I don't feel lonely. I found that the daily--get up, work, cook dinner, watch TV and go to bed routine can get lonely because it fits right in there with boredom. Staying sober has a way of allowing me to view life in a more positive light so I don't feel so bored and alone.


Member: AZbill
Location: az-bill@mindspring.com
Date: May 20, 2003
Time: 01:39 PM

Comments

Bill here, Alcoholic from Arizona. By the grace of God, the fellowship and a darn good 9th Step, I will be leaving my computer on Thursday May 20 to visit my former wife, my hubby in law and my six daughters in Va beach, Stops along the way will be Fairfield, TX, S.E. Indiana and Cincinnati. I expect to return sometime early July but you know what we say about expectations. I will be traveling interstates, 10,20,30, 40, 65, 71 to Cincy and S.E. IN. Then 75 and 64 into Va Beach.. If I pass you close and y'all want a coffee and a meeting email me. I will sincerely miss you guys. Bill


Member: Diane
Location: Oklahoma
Date: May 20, 2003
Time: 01:43 PM

Comments

have a good trip Bill, so will you have your puter with you on your trip? I was in Texas but back home now in Oklahoma and happy to be here even with those tornadoes I still love my Oklahoma


Member: Marsha L
Location: Michigan
Date: May 20, 2003
Time: 02:45 PM

Comments

Hi Bill--Have a good trip--take some Claritin along.


Member: Kim D.
Location: Bridgewater
Date: May 20, 2003
Time: 04:06 PM

Comments

Hi ((everyone)). Kim here, alcoholic. Just wanna say that ((Patty B.)) you've got it down in your first post, IMO. Those 25 days look AWESOME on you! When the lonlies hit - and they do even if you have a HP in your life because we are human - help others. We can not feel alone while being of service to another.


Member: Diane
Location: Oklahoma
Date: May 20, 2003
Time: 04:50 PM

Comments

very true Kim, helping others takes away lots of lonliness


Member: Kelly M
Location: NH
Date: May 21, 2003
Time: 12:15 AM

Comments

Hey Bill, Have a GREAT TRIP! Sounds like quite the road trip. It definately has to be one of the gifts of sobriety and the steps to be welcome at your ex's house. See you in July... i'll miss ya. Have a safe trip. Kelly :)


Member: Kelly M
Location: NH
Date: May 21, 2003
Time: 01:06 AM

Comments

Hey Bill, Have a GREAT TRIP! Sounds like quite the road trip. It definately has to be one of the gifts of sobriety and the steps to be welcome at your ex's house. See you in July... i'll miss ya. Have a safe trip. Kelly :)


Member: L-RAY
Location: somewere in Spain
Date: May 21, 2003
Time: 10:16 AM

Comments

(((AZ Bill))) have a great trip and be safe , regards L-ray


Member: max c
Location: houston tx.
Date: May 21, 2003
Time: 10:20 AM

Comments

hello everyone. poor me,whew what a life.u don't have 2 live like that anymore.lonliness the only way i have found 2 get out of that feeling is like everyone has said meetings,reading,prayer, and working with others (if all else fails).I get thinking about my problems and lonliness,isolation sets in.my sponser said there was nothing wrong with isolating except i get a lot of bad advice.when i get off my ass and out of my head things just get a little better. when i go 2 a detox center and work with others my problems seem very silly. the experence of working with another person and giving them some strength and hope of this program is very powerful.works 4 me and i didn't come up with the idea. was given 2 me freely from other people doing the same.lonlieness usually is directly tied 2 my selfesh and selfcentered ways.off the topic now.4 mr miricle drug upstairs.if just not drinking did it 4 me i guess that would be great,but seem like the drinking,drugs and many other addictions were but simptons of my problem.after 18 months of not doing any of the above i got pretty lonely.I had 2 fill the void that caused the problem.and the 12 steps gave me the tools 2 do so.but 2 each his own.good news u never have 2 drink or drug again.and best of all u never have 2 feel like u felt when u walked through the doors of aa.just remember,no matter what KEEP COMMING BACK. sorry about the length of my opion.lol and by the grace of god its been 10days 9months and 5yrs 4 me.and that's about all i understood the first yrs is KEEP COMMING BACK took me a while 2 get dumb enough 2 let this program work on me.thanks 4 being there 4 me.


Member: Diane
Location: Oklahoma
Date: May 21, 2003
Time: 10:42 AM

Comments

Hi Diane here and Day 57 sober, it is easier each day to not even want a drink, I surfed to another site yesterday with completely different views then AA group and boy do they dog the AA thoughts and since my Son did the rehab thing he has slipped many times so my question is why can't we find a good answer to helping us stay off drugs and Alcohol?.... the reason I've surfed to other sites is in a desperate attempt to find an answer that can help my Son, I'm doing fine on AA program but with younger folks it don't always seem to work,


Member: Marsha L
Location: Michigan
Date: May 21, 2003
Time: 11:10 AM

Comments

Hi all (Diane) Keep searching around. I come back to this site once a day and read the posts and because I think that programs can work together, I use a womens group also. There I have found more answers. The resources out there are awesome and then there are some who just deal with bashing different groups. I have come to realize that MY main issue is one concerning self esteem and in part lonliness. I am happily married but I know that there are issues that my husband would never understand in a million years. Thats why I really like the womens group. I take what works and leave the rest and I am really excited about my pathway down the road of sobriety. Keep looking for help for your son because you do find help in many different places.


Member: Julie M
Location: Alva Fl
Date: May 21, 2003
Time: 11:35 AM

Comments

Hi Everyone, Jules here. I don't understand the lonliness thing. I have been sober for a little while now and enjoy everyday of my new life. My family comes around on my days off and helps do yard work and fence builing. They sure wouldn't have come with me drinking. I have a job I love so much. I deal with sick people every day. We even have patients with dt's and I don't feel sorry for them anymore because they come in go back out and don't change people, places or anything. My aa friend always says "If I do what I've always done I will get what I've always gotten" No matter how much time goes by we have a problem that we can't drink....Remeber this and life each day can be really simple and better than ever. I'm not lonely even though my other half still drinks, I can control my life by not drinking. Life is good. Enjoy fellowship and sober friends life couldn't get any better. Thanks for letting me share.


Member: Linda C
Location: Pittsburgh
Date: May 21, 2003
Time: 02:59 PM

Comments

Thank you to the person who posted the link to Rational Recovery. You have saved my life and my sanity.


Member: Gypsy
Location: NJ
Date: May 21, 2003
Time: 03:45 PM

Comments

Hi all, A lot of good sharing on this page. You know, I am not lonley any longer. My lonliness was due to the use and abuse of alcohol and other substances. I would go out to have a good time, and was truly the life of the party. But alcohol once let me fly and then took away my wings. In the end, I was home alone driking, or buying a bottle of Vodka and slugging it down in the car, and throwing it out so I could get rid of the "evidence". (Like they couldn't smell it on me, or notice the change in my behavior! HA! Who was I kidding?) Lonliness and Vodka were my buddies. When Vodka had taken it's toll and left me broken and abandoned, lonliness stepped in and surrounded my soul, as I lay there sick ~ oh not so much with a hangover, but a soul-sickness that was much harder to get over. I detoxed myself (would not recommend it) a few too many times, and each relapse would bring on worse withdrawls. I finally had to surrender. I am powerless. Funny but the surrendering freed me. I have had to make a lot of meetings, and get involved in AA. I need to let people know me, and build a support group around myself, and come "clean" when I am sitting in some shit. Cause ya know what? I can't do it alone. I need all of you and my f2f AA'ers. Gotta get back to work ~ will be back. Let's just keep putting one foot in front of the other, and keep on keeping on, k? Hey Robert O ~ I'm from central Joisey too! Maybe we can catch a meeting.


Member: Diane
Location: Oklahoma
Date: May 21, 2003
Time: 05:08 PM

Comments

thank you Marsha and can you post the Woman's meeting? Linda said thanks for Rational Recovery, maybe I should check there also, I believe I have the power I need to stop my bad habits but I do admit I pray about my problems and my God always comes through


Member: Linda C
Location: Pittsburgh
Date: May 21, 2003
Time: 05:19 PM

Comments

Diane- Linda here. I pray, too; I'm a committed Christian, and therefore was not able to accept the idea of surrendering to "any old god of one's choosing." I appreciate that this site is here, and I'm not about to bash AA. But it's not for me. I've made a commitment to removing alcohol from my life; I'm done. Defeat the Beast! Linda


Member: Mike
Location: Colorado
Date: May 21, 2003
Time: 06:06 PM

Comments

(Linda C) This week it was me. I was checking in on this board to see if I'd stirred anyone up. Your reaction is exactly why I posted that link. I had the same reaction last week. My feeling is: If religion can make you quit boozing, great. For those of us that need something that is rational and not such a lifestyle, or a religion there are alternatives. By AA's own figures, 60% of people who successfully quit drinking do it without AA. AA would then 'diagnose' these folks as being afflicted with yet ANOTHER mysterious illness: 'the dry drunk." Well, there aint no such thing. Powelessness is an excuse to have a relapse. YOU are in control of your life and your issues. Quit your way, I will mine. I am opposed to AA's dogma, and I will continue to pepper these boards with alternatives. Your post has made my day. I think someone in this room pointed me there, as well. Screw it, I'm signing my name.


Member: Mike
Location:
Date: May 21, 2003
Time: 06:08 PM

Comments

Oh, yeah. aadeprogramming.com is a good one too.


Member: gary s.
Location: seattle
Date: May 21, 2003
Time: 06:15 PM

Comments

Hi group. I found your site for the first time because of an article I read in the current issue of The Grapevine magazine. I didn't know that such a thing as an online AA meeting existd, but now I am glad that I found this site. A quick search-engine look and Kaching! here I am. I have read all the posts and look forward to contributing to the forum. Thanks for being online and thanks for the frank and honest discussion of alcoholism. I look forward to reading and contributing to the site in the days ahead.


Member: MartyG
Location: CowtownOH
Date: May 21, 2003
Time: 06:21 PM

Comments

Hi folks meg here a true alcoholic. lonliness was easy to address when i first got sober, lots of meetings, lots of social interaction with family and friends, time with my daughter and other activities. with the recent passing of my mother i have had to move back to her home to watch over my older sister, she is mrdd. this has cut drastically my evening meetings. when i first got sober meetings were out of the question, then i began to enjoy the respite they provided, now i downright miss them. who would have thunk? even though i can't attend as often as i wish, i do get the most out of the ones i can get to.also i read and pray with a little more regularity. i am able to post here and the cp and who can't resist the fine quality of the post over @ cp. hp is my answer to my present state and it ain't all that bad. just needed to vent. thanks love one another. meg


Member: Linda C
Location: Pittsburgh
Date: May 21, 2003
Time: 06:56 PM

Comments

Now I can thank you by name, Mike! I'm looking forward to a bright, beautiful, alcohol-free future. Was looking for a "helping hand" --- who knew it was at the end of my own sleeve???? I will count on God my Father to send me grace each day, but I will count on ME to stay away from the booze. "Not me" is not happy with "Me" right now! Too bad! Thanks again, Mike. I encourage anyone who is searching to check out Rational Recovery.


Member: Mike
Location:
Date: May 21, 2003
Time: 07:20 PM

Comments

Someone posted the following address: http://aaforum.org/12x12/12x12.htm Don't post there if you value your privacy. It logs and plainly displays your computer's IP address. For those not in the know, It's like your computers address, or phone #. So much for AA's Anonymity, huh?


Member: Diane
Location: Oklahoma
Date: May 21, 2003
Time: 09:42 PM

Comments

way to go Linda, I went there and went through the beast test myself and found it very helpful and very true I also feel there are other ways to stay sober, after all I have a son who went through the 30 day AA rehab and he is right now, I think? doing ok but, I just never know. I know I will stay off the booze I can do it.... I'm strong. is what my family always tells me, main thing is we set our minds to the path of sobriety and many other things in our lives also can be corrected


Member: John H
Location: FL
Date: May 21, 2003
Time: 10:32 PM

Comments

Hello all, 2nd day down. Had problems sleeping last night, but got up this morning remembering last night. Not looking forward to this weekend. Freinds don't know I'm trying to sober up. I'm always the party leader. Feel like I have to lock myself in the closet. Luckily wife is very supportive. But she can't babysit my 24/7. Hope I can keep it up.


Member: Diane
Location: Oklahoma
Date: May 21, 2003
Time: 11:02 PM

Comments

you can do it John


Member: manuel m
Location: yuma az
Date: May 22, 2003
Time: 12:37 AM

Comments

hey manuel drunk you know well this is my first time seeing an aa computer thing happening this is nice real nice i try to go to meetings every morning usually 630 am thats the best for me but i crave all day every day and i work from 11am-10pm and im stuck at work craving but now i found this very very nice i dont know im just happy that i found this site and gratefull for all of your comments and if anybody has a list of the 12 steps could you please email it to me please im barley working on my first 24 hours and im not even half way there but i still go to meetings so please hook me up with the steps and any other helpful info email dont trip its just my email "bitchkilla_12@yahoo.com" enough from me one love stay clean and sober


Member: Melanie
Location: Akron, Ohio, USA
Date: May 22, 2003
Time: 01:17 AM

Comments

Hi, I'm Melanie, an alcoholic. Lonliness was a fear that helped keep me drinking. I had "friends" at the bars. Who would I have if I stopped drinking? Well, I stopped drinking abruptly one day by suddenly checking in to a rehab. I just dropped off the face of the bar scene. I have been gone for years and no one has called to see what happened to me. Wait, I did get one call last year. My good friends that I had known for up to ten years didn't ask if I was alive. Now that's lonely. A.A. friends are different. Miss a few meetings and they say A.A. police calling! (it's a joke, don't get freaked out) Are you OK? Anything I can do to help? Want to talk? Now, a person could get used to that treatment. Now, you A.A. doubters are fully entitled to try other methods of staying sober. Lord knows I didn't ever intend to get tied up in this thing. But the thing is, A.A. saved MY LIFE. I'm not exaggerating. And I never wanted to work on those twelve steps either, but they made the life I have WORTH LIVING. I owe all that is right in my life to God and A.A. WHATEVER you choose to keep you sober, I wish you love and blessings.


Member:
Location:
Date: May 22, 2003
Time: 01:37 AM

Comments

To Mike and anyone else who knocks AA what are you doing here, go have a drink or two or 1000 nobody gives a shit for your I dont have a life opinion and an opinion is not like an asshole an opinion is an uniformed utterance. Yall dont bother me it just makes me wonder what a pathetic life you have, if I was you I wouldnt be doing this shit I would be in a nice cocktail lounge sipping oN some Crown Royal on the rocks, and chasing it down with an ice cold Heineken. Isnt one them higher ups in RR doing time for killing two people while drinking and driving.


Member: Carlc
Location: Texas
Date: May 22, 2003
Time: 01:38 AM

Comments

To Mike and anyone else who knocks AA what are you doing here, go have a drink or two or 1000 nobody gives a shit for your I dont have a life opinion and an opinion is not like an asshole an opinion is an uniformed utterance. Yall dont bother me it just makes me wonder what a pathetic life you have, if I was you I wouldnt be doing this shit I would be in a nice cocktail lounge sipping oN some Crown Royal on the rocks, and chasing it down with an ice cold Heineken. Isnt one them higher ups in RR doing time for killing two people while drinking and driving.


Member: Stacy
Location:
Date: May 22, 2003
Time: 02:03 AM

Comments

Stacy, 45 days. Been a few days since I've posted. Glad to be writing today, sober. I had dinner with an old friend and I told her everything that's been happening. I was telling her that I had become very isolated and lonely. The sun would go down, kids go to bed, husband working late. I felt so alone that I can still feel it in my gut how bad it felt! I have so many wonderful friends. I have such a full life and STILL I felt so alone. The more I drank, the more lonely I felt which made me drink still more. The vicious cycle. I'm so grateful that I'm not on that ride anymore. Life is not easy today. I spend many days frustrated, confused, overwhelmed, exhausted. But I do not feel lonely today. What a blessing. Take care.


Member: T-Bone
Location: S. Fl
Date: May 22, 2003
Time: 06:31 AM

Comments

Mornin, to those of you who have chosen ( and life is a series of choices ), other methods of sobriety, good luck. I believe most of us here wish you well, it's just that we in AA believe it works because it has woked or is working for us. Just remember we or someone else will be here if you decide to come back. We are suckers that way. God bless.


Member: Marsha L
Location: Michigan
Date: May 22, 2003
Time: 07:01 AM

Comments

Good morning all--(Stacy) You said that well. (Diane)Women for Sobriety is the site. It just offers more tools and works on issues of self esteem and NOT bashing. I just want to say something that I think about AA. The establishment of AA has probably been the cornerstone of the pyramid of information that we have been shown to draw from. I feel that our HP manifests itself in many different ways according to what might work for us. Some need to use different methods to get and stay sober but in the end we are all working toward a common goal. Let me be so bold to say that AA can be beneficial for some because it gives them something to blow off steam and to bitch about and that can be a good thing. AA has helped me because it gave me a start and I am OH so thankful. Thanks for hearing my share.


Member: Linda C
Location: Pittsburgh
Date: May 22, 2003
Time: 08:24 AM

Comments

Glad to see you are keeping an open mind about recovery, Diane! Mr. No-Name above has an "open mind" too. Unfortunately, it's also empty; "uniformed utterance"???? Is that what you hear while sitting on folding chairs? Talk about pathetic! By the way, the man who was responsible for that fatal wreck was NOT involved in RR - he was one of the group who promote "moderation". RR is about making a decision for an alcohol-free life NOW. Here's what I don't understand. If I had continued to come here and repeat all the AA mantras day after day, even if I had gone on a huge binge I would have been welcomed back with open arms and much cooing about how we all relapse from time to time. But I make a conscious decision to quit drinking for life and I'm told to go have a drink because no one here gives a sh!t about my opinion? If that isn't cult mentality, I've never heard it. It sounds to me like you are well into a bottle of courage at 1:38 AM - I'm surprised you didn't have the guts to sign your name.


Member: Jen G
Location: Central NJ
Date: May 22, 2003
Time: 08:49 AM

Comments

Jen here. About 8 hours sober. Lonely, yes. But I'm planning to find a meeting in my area. I've been to them before, but I have always felt alone even at the meetings--not because of the other people--they were all trying to be helpful. It has been "me" who didn't want to give myself over to anyone else or anything. I mean I have kept myself away from people and from sharing. I am hoping that in writing I will be able to share more feelings and feel less lonely. I'm a writer by trade, so it's the way I'm more comfortable communicating. Thanks for letting me say this.


Member: Marsha L
Location: Michigan
Date: May 22, 2003
Time: 09:18 AM

Comments

(Jen G) Good for you--eight hours is the beginning of a better life. You can do it. Don't feel alone. When I start to feel alone I make a list of possitive reasons why alone is good. (Time for self-nurturing--reading--saying insane things to your pets--prayer time--time on the treadmill or writing my journal and shopping) But--I know what you mean by feeling alone in your head. The longer I am sober the better I am dealing with the alone thing. When I sobered up I went through an awful depression that has only cleared in the last few days. I was a secret drinker and very alone with my bottle. I realized that I was allowing alcohol to create a vicious cycle. If you look up vicious it means something like invalid. I have felt the clearance of alcohol from my system and I know my wellness will depend on sobriety. Thanks for listening.


Member: Donna P
Location: Graceville, F;
Date: May 22, 2003
Time: 10:55 AM

Comments

Donna, alcoholic. I drank for many years because drinking made me feel normal & fit in. After many, many years of drinking I thought life sucked, I was lonely even though I had 3 children & a man in my life, a job, a car. That was what I thought the American Dream was all about & I had it & was miserable. I wanted to die & did not know what the problem was. I met someone in AA & they started me on this road of recovery that was 13 years ago. When I got here I had no resentments, very few character defects, & I was not insane. At least that was my thinking after being in the rooms, getting a sponsor, working the steps & passing it on. I now know that the booze had really done a job on my mind. I was so negative, I had no clue how to be positive. I can tell you today my life is so much better. I go to lots of meeting, am active in service work, sponsor people. A lot of the negativity has gone. I love this way of life. AA has given me a way to like you, like myself & like life. So for me it is well worth the time. One day at a time I get better & better. Thanks for letting me share.


Member: Carlc
Location: Texas
Date: May 22, 2003
Time: 11:20 AM

Comments

I did sign thats why I posted the second time, it didnt come out the first time. You still dont get it, it is none of my business if you drink or not, thats up to you all the ass kissing in the world is not going to make you stop. A decision is just a thought, you can decide till you are blue in face but until you follow that decision up with some action it is still only a thought. If you want your ass kissed there are plenty of people who subscribe to let us love you untill you can learn to love your self. If you want an easier softer way thats your bussinss, AA the real AA for people that really want it and are willing tt make the effort. By the way I am a free man and I can keep any hours I chose, Carl in Texas.


Member: max c
Location: houston tx
Date: May 22, 2003
Time: 11:24 AM

Comments

hello again sry 4 the second post this week but i never was 2 good at keeping my mouth shut. just wanted 2 inquire why people would be bashing,recomending,trying 2 sway people at a early sobriety meeting.kinda like going 2 a detox center and telling people this is a waist of time.Give em a break. the main thing here is 2 get off the drugs and drink, I thought.It is all about choices but,a person has 2 have a little sober time 2 make rational choices sometimes.for me anyway,I had 2 get some direction before i could regain the choice 2 use or not use.i had lost that choice and didn't know how 2 live without drugging and drinking.newcommers just stay put 4 a while. and know that after we get sober we usually need help in other ways and there are many places,groups,programs 2 get it.keep an open mind 2 any help available.but, again,4 me I had 2 get a little sober time 2 c the way.one more thing then i will shutup (sry)I do hear a lot of crap in aa (and other programs)meetings as well as seen a lot of people that i sure don't care 2 have what they have(2 thy own self be true).Just because it is said in a meeting or post dos'nt mean its fact. if u hear it from 3 different people u may want 2 check it out.and i still havn't found relaps in the book.says something like rarly have we seen a person fail,who has throughly followed our path(I kept missing that second part).follow the path it leads 2 a good life with a lot of help from many sources.thanks 4 being there 4 me good luck


Member: Diane
Location: Oklahoma
Date: May 22, 2003
Time: 11:55 AM

Comments

hi Diane here Day 58 sober and I have to say I like this site and I do like AA so I am not in know way dogging AA groups. I believe in a power higher then me which is my God and I also believe he has helped me to recover from being a drunk, I do also know I need to work the program to stay sober cause from past slips I realized on this time around that I needed something other then just me to keep me sober....


Member: Diane
Location: Oklahoma
Date: May 22, 2003
Time: 01:15 PM

Comments

one more thing to say, I do also believe that different strokes for different folks and in no way will I dog any program that helps someone to get off booze or drugs, to each his own


Member: Diane
Location: Oklahoma
Date: May 22, 2003
Time: 01:35 PM

Comments

forgot to say thanks Marsha L for the site I'll try and find it


Member: Linda C
Location: Pittsburgh
Date: May 22, 2003
Time: 01:59 PM

Comments

Carl: you are SO obviously typing while drinking. I HAVE followed up my decision with action. I'm DONE, buddy! And I sure don't recall asking to have my a$$ kissed. My arms and legs are under my control. I marched myself into my local community college today and signed up for Fall courses! (I'm 56 years old.) I'm NOT going to spend all of next Fall sitting in some church basement listening to guys like YOU confessing relapses (OK; God -as we know him - was supposed to take care of this, so it's apparently HIS fault that I got drunk last night!) I'm back here because Mike showed me the way out of here into a healthy life. If you think that "god" is some giant cosmic vending machine, and you can get what you want by simply inserting the right number of coins and pushing the right button, you are not THINKING at all. Thanks again, Mike.


Member: Mark
Location: Albany,NY
Date: May 22, 2003
Time: 03:52 PM

Comments

Linda C.))) You Go Girl!!!! Keep on keeping on, sweetheart, sounds like your on the road just please don't let "them" get you off track!! Carl C.))) At the same time your points are well taken, except that is YOUR version of AA, not the "REAL" AA!!! Since when did God make any One person the keeper of the real AA, INCLUDING Bill W.?? You don't get to define the "REAL" AA for anyone but yourself and those who are either stupid or vulnerable enough to ALLOW you to!!! For ALL NEWCOMERS)))) Visit the coffe pot and you'll get to see these self-appointed gurus who simply don't drink for periods of time, it's funny, yet extremely sad. Also, you should probably put your boots on first as it's really getting deep in there, if you know what I mean??? Later all you cool cats in cyber-land, MarkyMark


Member: Diane
Location: Oklahoma
Date: May 22, 2003
Time: 04:59 PM

Comments

hi I think the children are out of school now is why so many crazy post


Member: Joe P
Location: Chicago
Date: May 22, 2003
Time: 05:29 PM

Comments

My name is Joe, and I am an alcoholic. Fending off loneliness. When I came to AA, I found a fellowship of people I could relate to, something I hadnt found for many years without drinking alcohol. Whenever necessary, I can talk with others in AA and relate and connect. I began getting back involved in my life, my family, and my community as a result of staying sober, and I began to make connections with other people who are not in AA. But early on, I spent a lot of time at small meetings where I could get to know people. WTG all of you.


Member: Jen G
Location:
Date: May 22, 2003
Time: 05:43 PM

Comments

What do you do when you know you have a problem and you just can't seem to stop? You know that your family and husband hate you for it, and yet, you seem to believe (when sober) that you can hide it, or that you can control it, or whatever? What do you do?


Member: Joe P
Location: Chicago
Date: May 22, 2003
Time: 05:58 PM

Comments

Jen - What I did was to locate and go to an AA meeting in my area (you can usually find AA in the phone book). I found out that we do not have to drink ever again, and how others go about doing that. I have to run; surely others will add to this.


Member: Mike
Location: Colorado
Date: May 22, 2003
Time: 06:14 PM

Comments

Feeling kind of apologetic today. I don't mean to mess with anyone's sobriety, or even 'save' anyone from the evils of AA. I'm just doing this, like everyone else with a drinking problem. Sometimes, it feels good to get it all out in a board full of folks that are also former drunks. It's nice to be able to share and it's nice to know there are others that are not so different from myself out there. Obviously, I do not subscibe to a lot of AA's methods. I explore other options. If that is something that is a tender spot for anyone, I can't really help you. I will say that abstinence is the only way I am comfortable dealing with my situation. If moderation were an option for any of us, I doubt we'd be taking so much time out of our lives in the hope that we can quit boozing it up. Treatment and recovery are the most important things in a lot of our lives right now. Justifiably so, I am sure. But along with all the dogma that I have no patience for, AA's the first place I came looking for help when I did not know where else to turn. Reading and posting has kept me out of trouble and it's kept me interested in methods of recovery. I will not say that AA is the only way or the best way, but it certainly is the most widespread and available treatment around for people that want to quit drinking alcohol. Before this last month, I had no idea there were alternatives for my situation. I failed in AA everytime I tried. I'm not alone. AA's got something like a 98% rate of failure. That's crazy, and we CAN do better. I'm glad to know there are other options. I'm happy to share what I've learned. Last week I got angry in this room. I felt like no one would listen to me. Like everyone's ears were full of what they'd been told by the program. Like no one wanted to see anything but conformist posts by people who had lost their faith in life. Lost their faith in themselves. As I said, I was angry. But I did come back (In frustration) to drop a few links cuz I still felt I had something to say. Linda, thanks for YOUR posts. A lot of people have written a lot of inspiring things here that make me keep checking in. Bikerbabe, you make me chuckle. I won't admit that I am powerless, and I won't get a sponsor, and I won't make a lifestyle or a religion out of an inability to control my own drinking. Does that make me a 'dry drunk'? I don't care. Realize that that is a term used in the program to keep everyone in rank and file. I'll continue to work on myself, and I will continue to keep alcohol out of my life. Beyond that, I have no problem with whatever folks want to label me. It's not me. You have no clue what is behind my eyes (or in this case, keyboard). My problem with AA has been it's inflexibility. It's dogma. It's one size fits all approach that leaves a lot of us holding the bag. There are lives to be saved here, and a lot of the time it's not AA saving 'em. (or Secular Sobriety, or Rational Recovery, or whatever program you're involved in.) Sometimes it's just a decision to free yourself BEFORE you hit 'rock bottom'. Before you're some burned out drunk in a church basement telling people how to run their lives. Sometimes you catch yourself sooner than AA wants you, or is ready for you. And that's where I think I am at. I don't drink, cuz I don't like myself drunk. I don't like that path that booze has laid before me. So, for all the folks that want to call me an 'atheist', or a 'dry drunk': I have my own faith and my own deal with god, It does not involve my recovery and it certainly does not involve AA. It's really none of anyone's business. Want to stop drinking/using? How about stopping drinking/using? It ain't 'Higher Power' lifting that glass. It isn't old'HP' that's going to make you put the glass down, either. It is YOU. The more you want to give up and not be responsible for, the closer you are to a relapse. Only YOU can decide to quit drinking alcohol. Support and therapy may help, but it's your accomplishment, not some vague idea of something greater than yourself. It reminds me of a little kid saying, "the devil made me do it." Grown ups are unfortunately held a bit more accountable than that. I've made my point. If you've read this: Thanks for reading, and do this for yourself. I really appreciate AA and all the other programs for the people and possibilities it shows me.


Member: Mike
Location: Colorado
Date: May 22, 2003
Time: 06:29 PM

Comments

and for my next number, watch me pull a rabbit out of my hat....


Member: Kelly M
Location: NH
Date: May 22, 2003
Time: 07:15 PM

Comments

((Mike)), Keep coming! You are a power of example to me. ((Jen)) I'm with ((Joe P))about calling and finding a meeting. It is good that you came here to see if you may need help. Keep posting and reading. I had a tough morning today but I picked up the phone and called a friend in AA. We took a ride in the country and went for lunch and I feel 100% better. Gotta run to a meeting. Bye 4 now. Kelly


Member: Marsha L
Location: Michigan
Date: May 22, 2003
Time: 07:27 PM

Comments

(Mike) Was that last comment from the Rocky and Bullwinkle Show? I liked your long post. It said alot to me. I sure don't like myself drunk and don't want to wallow in it either. AA ideas have taught me alot but the powerless thing is only true for me if I drink and I like to capitlize on all of the great powers old HP has given me. Thanks.


Member: Mike
Location: Colorado
Date: May 22, 2003
Time: 07:50 PM

Comments

(Kelly) Thanks! Yep, rocky and bullwinkle.. darn, that is a loooong post. Sorry. Pent up hot air, I suppose. I'm with you Marsha. 'Powerless' after that first drink. But, what if there is never that first drink again? No excuses, no poison, No poison, no problem.


Member: Melissa B.
Location: Canada
Date: May 22, 2003
Time: 08:11 PM

Comments

Well, here's my two cents, remember, it's only my experience, reading is optional, so is reacting (grin*). I sobered up through AA and what I discovered is how much power is achieved through the giving up of power. Which is a paradox, but I've found recovery and AA riddled with paradox. Before I gave up, literally threw down any power over alcohol, I was always in a struggle to control. I could always achieve control, but it always had a shelf life and I always gave up, got tired, got frustrated, got whatever, and ended getting out a drink. When I experienced my powerlessness over alcohol as an absolute given after having had the first drink, I just....gave up. Surrendered, whatever you want to call it. Out of that admission of powerlessness came the ability to not drink. Not drinking gave me sobriety, which gave me some clarity of mind (although not right away) which gave me the ability to understand the need to change at a fundamental level or I would end up drinking again. That's where the Steps and the practice of spiritual principles came in. I didn't have a clue how to change myself, but the work of the Steps accomplished that for me. I don't drink, and I don't need to drink and I don't crave or want a drink and it has been that way for years now. I just don't need to do that battle anymore. I experienced my recovery as a gift from a Power that I don't understand, and the working of the steps in my life. I am not a religious person and don't feel the need to be. But I am a person with alcoholism and I do need to take care of myself on a daily basis, much like a diabetic or a person with heart disease does. I practice tolerance now because it makes for a much more peaceful life and support anyone's recovery, through any means. But I wanted to get out from under my addiction, have it removed from my life, not just manage it, or control it, and that's why I found my answers in AA. Support and encouragement to all the newcomers, and an open mind!


Member: Melissa again
Location:
Date: May 22, 2003
Time: 08:23 PM

Comments

Oh, man - I got so caught up in reading the posts that I forgot lonliness was the topic. Apologies... I stopped being lonely when I started being honest.


Member: Mark M.
Location: Albany, NY
Date: May 22, 2003
Time: 09:00 PM

Comments

Mike from Colorado))) Dude, that is some of the best stuff I think I have EVER heard coming from ANYONE, regardless of the amount of time they haven't had a drink!!! I've been sober quite awhile and I'm very disenchanted with all the conformist ideology as well and these postings on the "pot" are practically ALL exactly that. I can assure you that there are those of us out here that are not only listening to you, but literally find you a "breath of fresh air"!! My basic premise is the only thing worse than being in the living hell of alcoholism is just being in a living hell without it, which is exactly where the most of long-term AAer's are at. Yet while I'm in absolute agreement that the vast majority of AA is simply conformity and just not drinking, there are the rare gems of humanity out here! Keep fighting the good fight my man and all will be well. I'm pleased to see your posts and will look for them in the future! Peace be with you my brother..........


Member: Mike
Location: Colorado
Date: May 22, 2003
Time: 09:02 PM

Comments

My 'higher power' tells me no more debates. LOL! I liked your post (Melissa). I'm on vacation. Most likely away from a computer. Be back the 1st. Happy, safe, sober holiday to all.


Member: Kelly M
Location: NH
Date: May 22, 2003
Time: 10:49 PM

Comments

Hi (Melissa), Great post! You really nailed powerlessness when you descibed it as : >>>Before I gave up, literally threw down any power over alcohol, I was always in a struggle to control. I could always achieve control, but it always had a shelf life and I always gave up, got tired, got frustrated, got whatever, and ended getting out a drink. When I experienced my powerlessness over alcohol as an absolute given after having had the first drink, I just....gave up. Surrendered, whatever you want to call it. Out of that admission of powerlessness came the ability to not drink.>>> Amen to that. Congrats on your longterm sobriety. We can't end the struggle with alcohol until we stop struggling. Nite All. Kelly


Member: Judi
Location: NC
Date: May 22, 2003
Time: 11:29 PM

Comments

Judi here, Alcoholic. I made it today by a nats hair! What a powerful desease. I can't believe its so hard for me to stay sober after my relapse. Yes I am powerless.I took this program for granted. I could be one of the thousands that don't make it now. I had 14+ yrs and just like that..... I'm back to being a very sick pup. Thanks for being here.


Member: Patty B
Location: Austin
Date: May 22, 2003
Time: 11:51 PM

Comments

I'd rather be lonely as far as romantic relationships go than to ever have another "beer goggles" relationship. I think that's the term, anyway. You know, those ones ya had near closing time..see the guys all got prettier at closing time for me! The time I realized that they probably thought I looked prettier at that time, too, was a pretty big blow to the ego! But how could I have been attractive..I was sucking down drinks as fast as possible..lots of times eating as much as possible before and afterward because of course food's a drug too, if you use it that way...and we got the carb cravings and there was almost always some fast food joint open or after hours club if you looked for it..I can't believe some of the rough places I went when I was drinking, drugging and eating. Ugh. I wouldn't let my worst enemy in those places today! Thanks to my HP, the steps and the meetings, the day at a time sobriety, the literature and this forum, I've got 29 days today. I'm finding I have more friends, and my friends I already had are even closer. Since toward the end of my drinking career I kinda isolated instead of going out partying..fortunately I don't have to worry too much about finding sober friends. It's so great! Thanks everyone. BTW..my sponsor obviously didn't work my steps with me, per se, she helped me review the pages of the 12 step workbook that I completed for that appropriate step, she asked me if I was saying my prayers and doing my meditations and fortunately I can say with all honesty, YES! Yeehaw it's great even in the midst of daily crap to know there's a solution and my life can be better if I let it. :) Peace y'all! Thanks for the support, the daughter is going to a church lock-in for teens tomorrow night. I didn't suggest it, she did! She says it is just a social event and maybe so but I say SOMEONE's really working in our lives! Yea God!


Member: Gypsy
Location: NJ
Date: May 23, 2003
Time: 12:11 AM

Comments

Hi Jen C ~ I live in Central Jersey too, you can e-mail me if you would like, perhaps we can hit a meeting together. To the folks who are promoting RR ~ I am truly happy that you have found a solution to your alcholism. Whatever floats your boat is all right by me. Hey, if standing on my head kept me sober, that is what I would do, and damn anybody who would tell me that it doesn't work. My question is this: Why are you posting on an AA site? Do they not have message boards at RR? I'm not being flippant, I just don't know. I am a very open minded person, and judge no one (cause who the hell am I ~ I certainly don't want to be judged for the shit I pulled while out there), but what concerns me is that you are messing with peoples heads who may truly need help in the early part of sobriety or perhaps the end stages of alcoholism. If they are smart enough to have found this site (I am presuming they did it through a search engine, like I did over a year ago), wouldn't info on RR be there as well? And if in fact it is, their being here is by their choice, just as those who go to RR is by choice as well. Do you also go into AA Beginners meetings and trash AA and tell the newcomer that there is a better way to get sober? Or do you wait outside of a meeting and then whisper it to them? If there are no RR boards, why not start one? Than those who would like to share their ES&H (if you guys use that lingo) re: RR have a place to go. Just wonderin'


Member: Bikerbabe
Location: Hellishelping
Date: May 23, 2003
Time: 12:22 AM

Comments

welcome back Judi..hello all.. thanx for that mike....(((and hello my dark angel... "mad marky mark.....((your bikerbabes favorite.. every wonder why? Anyhoole. i'm not the happiest camper in the park, but i'm not the saddest sailor on the sea. but i'm bikerbabe and i'm me. sometimes i'm not sure what i am really feeling or what is making me angry.... or why i have addopted my current "raging agenda" ((ehh 'eeemmm; But sometimes though, i get to see what is really going on with me, and why i am so hurt/angry... which is obvious looking at my behaviours...and all of a sudden something inside me softens.... and BAM! bikerbabes happy again.... and kickin it for ya all....love alcoholics... lov em! Bikerbabes got ONE GOAL, but sooo,, so many assists....


Member: gary s.
Location: seattle
Date: May 23, 2003
Time: 02:05 AM

Comments

Well this is my second post and I am enthralled?...intrigued? by the postings. So this is what a bunch of drunks look like when given a computer and an internet connection! So much...so much...I can't find the words. But here we are and I am glad I found this site. For today this is good enough.


Member: T-Bone
Location: S. Fl
Date: May 23, 2003
Time: 06:25 AM

Comments

Mike, no apolagies needed. I keep hearing this 98% don't make it. I don't believe those are AA numbers, actually I don't believe AA keeps those type numbers, your in, your out, your back in. How do you keep track of that. I do believe however that those numbers are consistant ( although I still think rather high ), with treatment centers and rehab facilities. Anyway back somewhat on point. I was poor when I used. I was lonely when I used. I've been broke occasionaly but not poor since I quit. I've been alone occasionaly but not lonely since I quit. It took me a long time to get here, but you know what. I was right on time.


Member: Marsha L
Location: Michigan
Date: May 23, 2003
Time: 06:36 AM

Comments

Good morning everyone--REALLY enjoying the posts. What more can I add except you help me to not feel lonely. I can relate to you all both from the possitive and the negative. Thanks for being here. I'm still sober and grateful and feeling a little better every day. Sincerely Marsha--P.S. I need some help--Here is the situation. I have been very good about resisting drinking and I don't have much of a craving--BUT my best friend-my sister and I live next door to each other and after work or on the weekends sometimes she would bring me an ice cold beer and we would sit and shoot the breeze. She has no idea how heavily I had been drinking and that one beer could have been my fifth one or sixth and I just don't know how to handle this. I really don't want to get into this with her but I want to not open myself up to a possible relapse. She is a practicing psychologist. She has even tested me and etc-etc---I just feel stuck on this one.


Member: Carrie
Location: Los Angeles
Date: May 23, 2003
Time: 07:03 AM

Comments

Marsha, page 101 in the third edition of the big book. "In our belief any scheme of combating alcoholism which proposes to shield the sick man from temptation is doomed to failure." You can't hide from it, but you don't have to tell people you are sober if you don't want to. You can tell her you are cutting calories and ask that she not bring over any beer. You could make a batch of Ice Tea and offer her some and politely refuse her beer. The relapse part is up to you, not up to who is drinking what and where.


Member:
Location:
Date: May 23, 2003
Time: 07:14 AM

Comments

((MARSHA%2yu qB=<(#mh=;gھRRRAd` ~GHP^qባi]O=J|*x~A? HAEbVzbS Hk%-(8`!2HM$I wA僧"! H5e4Hia4ZgxnE[#>qEqkXJ.!t[[


Member: Jen G
Location: Central NJ
Date: May 23, 2003
Time: 07:15 AM

Comments

Marsha L--I'd just tell your sister honestly what's up with you. Ask her not to bring the beer but to still come to talk. If she's a psychologist and your best friend, she'll understand. You need her support I think. Last night I said to my hubby, "I'm an alcoholic." First time I said it to him. I have been trying to pretend with him that I don't have a problem. But now I've asked for his support. He said yes. I know I still have to be the one to do the work, and I know that he doesn't have a drinking problem, so he'll probably never really understand, but he'll still support me.


Member: Marsha L
Location: Michigan
Date: May 23, 2003
Time: 07:50 AM

Comments

Thank you Carrie and Jen--Your advise means alot to me. Marsha L


Member: Diane
Location: Oklahoma
Date: May 23, 2003
Time: 08:51 AM

Comments

hi Diane here day 59 (YES) almost day 60 now I need to see if I can get a coin for 60 days sober, Marsha just tell your sister you are on a low carb diet and you found out that beer has too many carbs for your system to handle, I am on one and lost so much weight I am a different person in a different body and I'm so happy with me now, I think I told you I am on the Fat Flush Plain and it works on healing the liver, I think my good results of my weight loose is one big thing that keeps me from cheating and drinking any form of booze let alone any carbs


Member: Kelly M
Location: NH
Date: May 23, 2003
Time: 09:33 AM

Comments

Yahoo Diane!!!!!!!!! 60 days looks good on ya. Go to a meeting and proudly go up and get your 2 month chip.... you earned it. Feeling so good today. I am such a damn miracle. WELCOME GARY! Keep coming it gets a lot better. About stats on AA recovery.... Who gathers these? I have never been part of a pole. I'm going to a Soberfest Sunday that will have something like 5,000 people. I live in NH not New York and AA is alive and well here at least in my little state. Could anyone furnish where this (fact) comes from ??? Just curious. Off to participate in my day. Kelly PS. Bikerbabe if your ever in NH would you chair my meeting?


Member: Marsha L
Location: Michigan
Date: May 23, 2003
Time: 09:33 AM

Comments

Thanks Diane for your answer and I am going to look up that diet.--Marsha


Member: Marsha L
Location: Michigan
Date: May 23, 2003
Time: 09:36 AM

Comments

PS DIANE--CONGRATS ON 60!!!


Member: Diane
Location: Oklahoma
Date: May 23, 2003
Time: 09:51 AM

Comments

thanks all for your congrats on my soon to be 60 day, I am going to be at my Mom's house since she is having some surgery so may not even get to post for a few days so you all stay sober, I sure do like this little group even the one's who have different opinions give good advice and I do appreciate all the good reads, for I have a lot of issues and the reading really does help me, now the filthy mouthed child on here well he is just a child so we can ignore his filth and say a prayer for his soul


Member: Marsha L
Location: Michigan
Date: May 23, 2003
Time: 10:04 AM

Comments

YES Diane-- I don't know what that is all about above Jen G's post but WHATEVER. I don't feel lonely today.


Member: Tammy
Location: Colorado
Date: May 23, 2003
Time: 02:17 PM

Comments

Marsha, I think I know what you are feeling.....you don't want to have to express any weakness by calling yourself an alcoholic or in essence, you don't want to admit powerlessness over alcohol! I am in the same situation, been in my head about it for 2 days. A very close, sweet girlfriend of mine is spending the night at our house tonight (she's driving from way up north) and I have been "on the fence" about what should I do about drinking until I started talking out loud to my hubby about it, and he pointed out the insanity of what I was saying! I have not had a drink in 11 days and have been really starting to feel good and happy and just feeling like the old me is back but I don't want to have to be confronted with the offer of drinking, and I don't want to have to get into the emotional pain of telling someone else other than family that I think I might be an alcoholic, etc. I told my husband it would just be easier to drink and not have to deal with all of it. INSANE!!! I am going to tell her about it....after all she is one of my favorite closest friends and she will be supportive, so confront the fear and remember this is really all about step 1 and I suppose step 2! Have a great holiday


Member: Linda C
Location: Pittsburgh
Date: May 23, 2003
Time: 02:54 PM

Comments

Tammy: you are starting to feel "good and happy" and this is a very close, sweet girlfriend. Who better to be honest with? You are not powerless, Tammy. You have been sober for 11 days. You instructed your arms and legs to stay away from the booze, with the help of God, for 11 days. What an accomplishment! You would blow that now for the sake of PRIDE? I don't think so. Enjoy your visit with your friend, and live to remember it. Make a big pitcher of iced tea, or lemonade. Don't "explain" anything if you don't feel like it! I've seen in my 56 years that one of our biggest problems is that we think people should be ALLOWED to ask us "why"? No one has the right to ask you "why". Just do what's right for you, and enjoy the visit.


Member: Gypsy
Location: NJ
Date: May 23, 2003
Time: 02:57 PM

Comments

Hi Diane, Could you e-mail me and tell me a little bit about the Fat Flush Plan? Sounds intriguing, and I need to lose at least 20 lbs! Yeah, yeah yeah, this is AA, but my self esteem would be sooooo much better, if I dropped a few lbs! gypsydancer830@aol.com Thanks


Member: Tammy
Location: Colorado
Date: May 23, 2003
Time: 03:50 PM

Comments

Thanks Linda C! I know that is the reasonable thing to do....but I always say it is a hard situation to stay sober with the same brain that got you into the drinking in the first place! I think that is the powerlessness. If we don't talk out loud about the reasoning that we use to justify our continuing to do the same thing with same terrible results, it is difficult to move forward. So it is honesty for me, if not to others at least to myself!


Member: MartyG
Location: CowtownOH
Date: May 23, 2003
Time: 06:07 PM

Comments

good post this week, ((PattyB,Austin)) i thought only women looked better @ closing time and all us men looked the same all night long lol. love one another meg


Member: Heather M
Location: xrds of the west
Date: May 23, 2003
Time: 07:22 PM

Comments

Loneliness? RR folks, bully for you, but I need my HP, whom I choose to call God. I don't think it's an accident that God helped me find (out of over 10 pages of results on Google) the link to the group talking about loneliness. I'm losing my best friend and roomie due to my insane behavior while drinking. I found this because I absolutely, completely had to stop, as in NOW!!! Maybe I can still salvage my relationship with my friend, but either way, this group (dissenters included) is a lifesaver. I live in a bizarre neighborhood, which also happens to be unusually dangerous to women, so I can't even go to the mailbox, and my husband works downtown and just got put on overtime, so I'm dang lonely. Forced physical isolation has cost me a lot of friends over the last year or so, and my family is currently even more scattered than they usually are and none of them have ever even had one drink, so they just don't get it. Years and years ago, before I "went back out", my home group (physical at that time) was mostly oldtimers and I felt strange there; it's great to be in a group of people who are fighting with either comparatively low sobriety (8 hours) or contemplating a vacation with no alcohol. Me? I completely relate; this week, it took every ounce of determination I could scrounge up to quit for a whopping 32 hours, and then I started drinking again. I'm proud of myself; I've only had one today and I got myself to this meeting, which is my escape route. It's been so long since I was sober that my Big Book is in storage and probably mouse-chewed by now, even if I could find it, but this group is saving my life. I haven't had another drink today and I think I can make it through the rest of the 24 hours without one, but the best thing is that if I don't think so, now I have somewhere to turn, when I have never felt more alone in my life. This friend is one I've had for 15 years, and my husband and I were on the verge of a divorce, so I've definitely hit "rock bottom"; in fact, I think I drilled a new basement in the bottom of THAT. The good thing is that my HP is still there; I don't have to be rational to talk or listen to Him. (Besides, since when did rationality have anything to do with being alcoholic? Time after time, I have known if I took the first drink, my chances plummeted of quitting at one, but I was so sure that the hand at the end of my arm, connected to my brain, would somehow receive rational instructions, that I thought I could have one. Or none, because all I had to do was decide. Call me a wuss, but I'll trust in a power much greater than I am, and so far, when I've had the courage and humility to ask, every single time, that Power has answered, and given me even more than I dared ask for or could ever, ever have come up with myself. That power is the only hope I have that I'll survive this loneliness. That Power led me to this group, and that Power will nudge me to return to it if I turn my will over to Him. I'm a control freak about running my own life and I'm failing miserably; this time, I'm at least going to try to let someone who can see the road clearly do the driving. At this point I'll settle for the next hour sober, let alone 24, because even that long seems bloody hard right now. In case I forgot to say so at the beginning, I'm Heather and I'm absolutely alkie. Sorry about the long post, but the whole weeks' worth and the imminent loneliness of friend not coming back and finding out about OT for hubby really set me off. Thanks, all. PS- where does one obtaine a 12-step workbook, as was prev mentioned? I could sure use one!!! Hang in there and KCB;IWIUWI!


Member: Terry M.
Location: Texas
Date: May 23, 2003
Time: 08:47 PM

Comments

I sure can relate to Jen G. I have been to AA on and off for years. And therefore I have not done real good with my (not) drinking, It has almost cost me my marriage, in fact I am not sure that it has not at this moment. I have to stop TOTALLY! I think that is realized now .... I have only had a drink twice in the last 6 months, and only once in the 2 months before that, but still ... I am so happy to have found these postings on this site, at just the right time ...


Member: Robin
Location: Iowa
Date: May 24, 2003
Time: 12:59 AM

Comments

Loneliness is happening right now. My husband told me I was a stupid F##ker this evening while I was home at lunch and then he went to bed before I got home so that we cannot resolve this issue tonight ("well isn't that special?"). I really had to restrain myself from not running down to that bar to drown my sorrows, I came here instead. I don't feel so lonely right now. Thank you all. I have been sober for 56 days now.


Member: Bikerbabe's not finished
Location: Half way to hell is helping
Date: May 24, 2003
Time: 01:15 AM

Comments

For anyone who has had a 'diffi "cult" time in aa......


Member: Joe
Location: Holes
Date: May 24, 2003
Time: 01:25 AM

Comments

Robin, get a big knife and go into where your husband is sleeping, then ..................


Member: Joe
Location: Holes
Date: May 24, 2003
Time: 01:28 AM

Comments

Robin, get a big knife and go into where your husband is sleeping, then ..................


Member: CARLC
Location: NM
Date: May 24, 2003
Time: 02:59 AM

Comments

I guess I will never understand why people who worship themselves, the devil, each other and all kinds of other shit, want to push their shit on poor suffering alcholics who are already fucked and now getting fucked and bullshited by this mental masturbation, for the suffering alcholic AA has the answer for you if you want it and are willing to make the effort, for the rest go have a drink, or two or a thousand believe me nobody cares. It boggles my mind why people do it, I am not a Mormon, or a Catholic, or a Christian, but I do not spend one second in their churchs or websites trying to tell them what to believe.


Member: Carrie
Location: Los Angeles
Date: May 24, 2003
Time: 04:25 AM

Comments

Welcome back Heather! Go to a meeting and you can get all the literature you want and a better chance at staying sober another 24 hours. This isn't a meeting, it's a help, but it's not a meeting.


Member: Linda C
Location: Pittsburgh
Date: May 24, 2003
Time: 08:11 AM

Comments

Linda C here. Heather (and others who may think that RR teaches "moderation"). Not so! I learn a great deal by visiting this site, and I hear myself in so many posts; but I also learned that I can quit drinking - completely and forever - by learning to RECOGNIZE the voice of the BEAST within me who coaxes me to have "just one", and my OWN voice, which laughs and says, "well, that would be just plain stupid!" I, too, trust in God to send me the grace each day to do what is right so that I might live His plan for me. I know that His plan does not involve any future use of alcohol for me. "I know the plans I have for you ----- plans to prosper you and not to harm you. Plans to give you hope and a future." Jer.29:11. My HP wrote His plans for me in a book; but I've ignored it for most of my life. Not any more!l


Member: Carrie
Location: Los Angeles
Date: May 24, 2003
Time: 08:42 AM

Comments

GREAT article on the unrationality of rational recovery!! http://alcoholism.about.com/library/weekly/aa990616.htm


Member: Linda C
Location: Pittsburgh
Date: May 24, 2003
Time: 09:25 AM

Comments

Thanks for that link, Carrie. It's always a good idea to examine every angle. The writer attacks RR from the AA perspective, the same way RR attacks AA. One has a "victim" mentality and the other a "victor" mentality, so they will never agree. Those of us who are fighting our way out of the PROBLEM need to understand the difference and use what works for us. For instance, I will never attend another AA meeting, but I value the community that exists on this site. Like you said in a post above - this isn't a meeting. It most certainly is a help, though, and I hope it's OK if I hang out here. I promise to be good!


Member: Terry M.
Location: Texas
Date: May 24, 2003
Time: 01:59 PM

Comments

So right ... this is not a meeting, but it absolutely does help listening to others here. I am positive it will help me and my situation. It is amazing to me how so many people talk about the same problems that I have experienced, it always has been amazing to me. As for RR vs. AA. Hey, just do what works for you, that is what matters.


Member: Linda C
Location: Pittsburgh
Date: May 24, 2003
Time: 03:09 PM

Comments

I so agree with you, Terry. I think that most of us have fallen into a pit where we use alcohol to replace something else that is missing in our lives. But the insidious beast takes over other areas as well, and pretty soon the beast is all that matters. I've been married for 32 years, but I have no real relationship with my husband. He's been off doing "his own thing" from day one. We have four kids (all grown now) who I managed to raise on my own. Once they were gone, I had nothing. So I turned to the booze to comfort me. But it didn't. It made me sick. Over and over again. Did I stop? No, of course not. NOW, I recognize that there is something missing in my life. And it cannot be replaced with alcohol. So I'm working to establish a real relationship with my husband, and it's a rough road. But we are making progress (two steps forward, one step back). I'm pretty sure that the booze has been used to replace something important that is missing in ALL of our lives! My hubby is NOT happy with me right now. He is drinking like crazy, and I'm not drinking at all, and this is not working for him. He has had 32 years of my compliance, and this looks like a threat to him. (It may be!) There is LIFE out there for me, without alcohol, and I'm goin' for it!!!! I'm hoping he will be there, too. But is he decides to stay where he is, he'll have my prayers and nothing else.


Member: Bikerbabe
Location: Spiritually awakening?
Date: May 24, 2003
Time: 03:26 PM

Comments

Carl c.... you know.. your right... i agree. And i am sorry i plagued you and others with my anger and other bs... I am changing at the moment and i no longer wish to do that... (in other words bikerbabe will do her best to keep it to a minimum ODAAT. I am more interested in growing than saving face and how's the saying go? I'm sick , but i'm still SOOO PROUD! Well not today sweetheart,,, "what's happening to me!! i'm melting! i'm melting! ha haahaa


Member: Linda C
Location: Pittsburgh
Date: May 24, 2003
Time: 03:40 PM

Comments


Member: Linda C
Location: Pittsburgh
Date: May 24, 2003
Time: 03:56 PM

Comments

Hmmm. looks like my "comments" have been eliminated! Hey, Carl! GROW UP. Only Middle-School Kids think that 'course language' is cool. What are you? ---13? Try acting like a MAN, for heaven's sake! You're making a fool of yourself by using the language you use. There is no power in course language. You show your ignorance by using such language. Eveyone here is in the same boat as you are, for pete's sake. Don't push people away who can HELP you!


Member:
Location:
Date: May 24, 2003
Time: 04:40 PM

Comments

Linda why dont you concentrate on telling your husband how to talk, or behave , or whatever it is you want him to. I walk this earth a free man and no longer live in the prison of what people think, what you think about my language is none of my business and if I offended any ladies I apologize. I get pretty upset when I see people that are already down, get pushed down further by self rightous pharisees.


Member: Bikerbabe
Location: Hellishelping
Date: May 24, 2003
Time: 04:44 PM

Comments

Mike from Colorado...Thanks for that... i have my aa disapointments as well big time! I "listened to what you had to say" and it was very good.. i thought.. I will continue to make changes and grow..and i will continue to post here and carry a message with the god of my understanding... aa gave me something , i don't drink... but the aa cure caused me more grief than the problem so soo many times... looking back it was almost not worth it,,AA almost got me drunk many times..swimming in the sickness and regularly exposing myself to the negativity there was grueling, but i was so brainwashed at the time and frightened to death to leave. i get 12 step calls still and i tell people its up to them, but if i had to do it again... i would go to an a+d councillor twice a week,,, read all the literature i could get my hands on and whatever else and that i can get sober if i really want to many ways.. but i likely would never go to aa again,,,when i was still pretty sick i fit like a glove there at times... for obvious reasons.(( but holly man when you actually start to change and get well LOOK OUT! your all of a sudden not too popular,,, and like you said it,,, there you are holding the bag... and not meshing in the soup pot of co-dependancy and all the typical sick behaviours characteristic of people who are pretty damaged goods..and it takes most years and years to get to even a manageable normalcy devoid of glaring defects and issues with sex.. religion add infinitum. and why shouldnt it be that way...for gods sakes its alcoholics anonymous... people don't make it there because they are model citizens. Strange how people in aa talk about growth and change on + on... but nothing makes people more uncomfortable than when a person actually does it... hmmm. Guess it must be a tough nut like myself who becomes one of the few that go first class....that's right people.. i'm goin first class...and i am first class. material.. and there's nothing you can do about it.. PS..Linda c..what the hell are you talking about?


Member: Linda C
Location: Pittsburgh
Date: May 24, 2003
Time: 05:17 PM

Comments

I'm sure you have no clue. You are WAY out there, girl. WAY, WAY out there! Sober? I don't think so. Just on a trip of your own. Like lots of OTHER trips. How about you come on down to earth and try living in the real world? You KNOW what the H&LL I'm talking about, Bikerbabe! You just dont' want to LOOK at it! It looks too much like real LIFE! Don't want to deal with THAT, DO YOU? First Class? If you say so. Hmmm.


Member:
Location:
Date: May 24, 2003
Time: 05:23 PM

Comments

No wonder you are a "free man" Carl. What woman would want you?


Member:
Location:
Date: May 24, 2003
Time: 05:39 PM

Comments

Linda what in the world are you not only are trying to tell men what to do now you are telling woman what to do what is your next project monkeys?


Member: Bikerbabe's Live
Location: And Kickin it....yeee haaa
Date: May 24, 2003
Time: 05:52 PM

Comments

((Linda)) Honey... sweetheart)) Bikerbabe has thought about what you said and agrees... I better phone my Sponsor today and get the help i desperately need... Please accept my appologies and know that from now on i'll be doing it your way.... PS.... (I CHANGED MY MIND... KISS MY ASS!!!))) Booo Whaaaaaaaaaaa!! BRACK! BRACK!


Member: Hope
Location:
Date: May 24, 2003
Time: 07:30 PM

Comments

Loneliness (Mike - Colorado) Thanks for your posts and options. I looked for your name because I think you are on the same day not drinking that I am and I have lost count myself. I am sorry that you got some hostile reactions to some of your posts. I got the same from someone who was not even brave enough to leave their name on my second day and talk about loneliness ! This is the one place we are supposed to be able to come without shame or judgement and I got it anyway - at a critical time. When I decided to stop and my friends and loved ones made fun of me, I didn't feel alone because I understood thier agenda. When I am the only one who doesn't take a drink surrounded daily by people who do, I didn't feel alone. But when one stranger on this web site told me I was wasting her time but writing too much I wanted to go back to the old lifestyle and never post again. I could speak to the level of intelligence and higher power that some of the attackers show that they don't have- but it would make me no better. You also took a higher road. Luckily I have found that their are many more kind people here than not so I kept coming back. I personally enjoy every single post because everyone here is not were we should be in life and we are brave enough to admit and risk talking about whatever we need to. We cannot afford to alienate one another. The rest of the world doesn't relate and we have to accept that we all come from different backgrounds, and views. We have one thing in common and everything else isn't. For those few people who get very hostile to variety in our group please don't underestimate how potentially lonely you have the ability to make someone else feel; and if that holds no value for you then at least recognize the one who rejects differences will be the loneliest one of all. God Bless & Peace everyone - Please. ps. (Mike, CO) If you have not read Ayn Rand's books I am sure you would enjoy them .


Member: John D
Location:
Date: May 24, 2003
Time: 08:45 PM

Comments

As a newcomer i am a bit shocked by the content of this site. Is there no way of blocking out people who clearly shouldn't be here? (i mean bikerbabe)


Member: ??
Location: ??
Date: May 24, 2003
Time: 09:27 PM

Comments

Bikerbabe=MarkL


Member: Kelly M
Location: NH
Date: May 24, 2003
Time: 11:06 PM

Comments

Hi All, What an up and down week I have been having! It has been so good to ease up on F2F meetings and just read here. (Bikerbabe), I could relate to something you wrote because I'm going through a stage of growth lately. You wrote: >>> and not meshing in the soup pot of co-dependancy and all the typical sick behaviours characteristic of people who are pretty damaged goods..and it takes most years and years to get to even a manageable normalcy devoid of glaring defects and issues with sex.. religion add infinitum.>>> Hope you do not mind me pasting your quote. I wrote it down, it rang so true for me. I'm taking a vacation from the soup pot of some of the AA's I attend meetings with for a while. I had to draw the line where getting better is more important than marinating in mental illness in some meetings. Some people I swear just go to AA because it is one of the last bastions where they can't get kicked out from. If no one else will listen to you go to AA and speak at every meeting knowing you can't be asked to leave. It gets tiring because some of these people have over 10 years and zero growth they just replaced drinking with bitching and moaning or using meeting time as a free therapy session... and lets not forget the drama queens that use AA as a stage. They come in fine and as soon as they get called on to speak the water works start and they bemoan all their woes and want sympathy. How can I PITY them when they are always creating chaos to talk about while doing nothing to change? What about the ones that want to change? I'm just lucky I have enough meetings to dodge some of these people that irritate me. I am not ready to throw the baby out with the bathwater because I need AA. It got me sober and I am grateful to the program. I will stay with AA ... warts and all. I CAN however understand why people leave when they start getting healthy. You become an ugly reminder to the sick ones of what they are lacking in their recovery. We all go in very sick people but some of us make it and some don't. I'm rambling... I just agree with part of what you said. I know I need to practice acceptance. For now I am just going to do what I need to do for me and that is back off from some meetings. Thanks for letting me share. Kelly


Member:
Location:
Date: May 24, 2003
Time: 11:45 PM

Comments

kELLY THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU.


Member:
Location:
Date: May 24, 2003
Time: 11:57 PM

Comments

I Love BIKERBABE


Member:
Location:
Date: May 24, 2003
Time: 11:59 PM

Comments

I Love BIKERBABE


Member: Bikerbabe
Location: Hellishelping
Date: May 25, 2003
Time: 12:03 AM

Comments

Kelly m))) no i don't mind at all its all yours. post it whever you...anyhow... that's just me being a goof again...hehehhe ((seriously though... i liked what you posted, and i must tell you some more truth if you don't mind. The amount of people in aa who are literally going to 4+ meetings a week... doing all they've been programmed to do and are still sucking on 1 or 2 packs a day... still burnin resentments, blaming and angry for the most part is not so astonishing to me anymore... further more; these same ones have devoted theirselves to coffee and newcomer stress after the meetings 24-7 and are rejecting thier own lives... taking antidepressants, drinking pots and pots of coffee and smokin 2 packs a day and talkin about recovery and doin recovery 24-7..I finally told one member not long ago that i thought it would be a really good idea for her to stop going for a while as it clearly wasnt helping her cause... I guess what i'm saying is there's a balance and if you can find it for yourself super... i used to feel that if i went to one more meeting i was going to get drunk... (( OH YOOO HOOOOOO JOHNY De eeeeee .....well welcome sweetheart... are you John John the lepricon? And are you posting when you have no clothes on? i'm bikerbabe and my harley only looks bad. Wanna go for a ride? Bikerbabe loves newcomers..


Member: Kathy K.
Location: Northeast
Date: May 25, 2003
Time: 04:22 AM

Comments

John D. - just hang in there - the poster of whom you are speaking has only recently come here - hopefully will leave just as quickly. When I see the name just keep scrolling - To the women who spoke of their husbands still drinking - not at all uncommon for husbands to become upset. They have lost their drinking buddy when you sobered up. Don't let that send you right back to the bottle. It's YOUR life that's on the line here. Am surprised at all the criticism of AA - how about spending a good solid year in AA - following the suggestions - such as attending many meetings - (Step - Discussion - Open - Closed - Big Book - Beginners)- getting a sponsor and using that sponsor - sticking with the winners - being more positive in your approach to sobriety. You have only scratched the surface of the Program - how do you really know so much?? Point is - you don't - not yet. Please - you owe it to yourself to invest at least a year to try .......God bless