Member: Curtis L
Location: Goliad, Texas
Date: 7/22/01
Time: 12:00:16 PM

Comments

Let's talk about sex and what a barrier it is in the fourth and fifth steps.


Member: Curtis L
Location: Goliad, Texas
Date: 7/22/01
Time: 12:04:16 PM

Comments

Let's talk about sex and what a barrier it is in the fourth and fifth steps.


Member: Mike M
Location: st Paul MN
Date: 7/22/01
Time: 1:40:35 PM

Comments

I'm not sure What do you mean by barrier? Are you talking about being afraid to be honest with another human being? One of the most important things is finding the right person to do this with. Another aspect is to be THOROUGHLY HONEST about everything, EVEN SEX!!!! The fifth step is not a confession to the listener it's about facing the fears within yourself so you can get on with living and following through with the rest of the steps. It made me feel like I belonged in this world. It says in the BB that if we skip this vital step, we may never get over drinking!!


Member: Dave S
Location:
Date: 7/22/01
Time: 2:03:40 PM

Comments

Sex (whether it be obsessing over, porn, come ons that are dishonest...)as a problem vs. sex in a relationship in which you are involved and/or is satisfying/dissatisfying??? Geez!!! I guess the previous post says it best... HONESTY in confronting our defects that could seriously affect our sobriety...


Member: ML
Location: San Diego
Date: 7/22/01
Time: 2:21:47 PM

Comments

I was sorry not to participate in this meeting last week as the week before it was such a help to me in getting through very rough situation, and some people responded to my sharing with empathy and identification. What I did re: that situation is probably right on this topic, or certainly related, so here it is.

After my fiance's drinking escalated and I drank with him, losing my sober time and having to start again, he kept drinking. Things got really scary - he was holed up in the garage, only coming out for more vodka, for three days. I was afraid he'd hurt himself or me, burn the house down (with his reckless smoking), etc. I knew he was in a really grave, heavy place, and that when he drinks that much he's not "himself" anymore. I finally called the cops and followed their repeated advice to get a restraining order. It's been a really odd time for me - at first, when he got out of jail, I was afraid he'd violate the restraining order & return, in a rage, drunk. Then I heard he'd checked into a treatment center, and I was elated. Then I heard it wasn't completely voluntary, and was depressed. Then I heard from him Friday night and found out he likes the treatment center and, at least a day at a time, is really into recovery. I want those of you who were so supportive in relating their own experiences helped me to have the tough love needed to finally let go of what had turned into a terrible and dangerous situation. And the result: Will's checking into a treatment facility is my dream, but I didn't dare hope for it. Maybe higher power, huh? We'll see... for now, I'm back to being able to look at me and work on my own recovery, which brings me to:

I believe that doing an inventory on one's relationship patterns & sexual behavior along with staying sober in these areas is a big part of practicing these principles in all our affairs. And I didn't. When I fell in love with the person described above I took my will back, pursuing a relationship with an active alcoholic. And I did end up drinking, and losing my sobriety - for a while, last year, for much longer than my one-night slip of three weeks ago. I felt so far from God after six months of it (and having experienced the program and the gifts of service and serenity it can give me - I started AA 16 years ago and have worked some of the other programs) that I awoke last November in tears. I realized nothing, not even being with someone who in some ways seemed perfect for me, was worth that separation from God and from the service work I'd been doing, and abandoned,because of my drinking and my relationship.

Eight months later I see what I finally did in ending the relationship/living situation, at least for the time being, as being a bigger commitment to myself and recovery than I've ever made. I hope my sponsor lets me go right into my fourth step, as it's the one I was about to do anyway, and the one I think I must do to "keep green" about my cross-addictive pattern of drinking around sex and relationships, thus, hopefully, avoiding that pattern in the future. At this point I'm frequently depressed, lonely, scared about my finances, and unsure I'm out of the woods with my fiance's drinking and my ability to be strong and stay away from him unless he shows a long-term commitment to sobriety. It's not easy, as they say. It's really hard to be a "newcomer" after 16 years! I know the program has already had a big effect on me, so it's hard to raise my hand when they ask if there's anyone "under 30 days." But that's how the program works, and I have to follow the rules. I've been tempted to just want to look at my family abuse history and codependency, since my drinking is episodic, and say I'm not an alcoholic and I'm tired of the complicated work I have in front of me in really recovering and looking at everything I need to look at. So I'm working hard to keep it green about my drinking and its effects, too. I look forward to reading the rest of this meeting, this week. Peace to all.


Member: Curtis L
Location: Goliad, Texas
Date: 7/22/01
Time: 5:36:07 PM

Comments

Dear Fellowship,

My name is Curtis L, and I'm an alcoholic and a fallible human being. I did not get to finish my post this morning for a topic, so I'm here for the second and last time this week.(to write, I'll be reading all week). We share our experience, strength, and hope here. I've been sharing mine and listening to others for a little over 16 years without a drink.

One of the things I've observed in sponsoring many people, and after experiencing it with my sponsor is the most difficult subject to be completely honest about in the fourth step is sex.

I had done many things in my adolesense and my drunkeness that I did not want anyone to know about, even God. The false pride and fear of rejection loamed over me each time I tried to write in complete detail how my sexual behavior had harmed others and my self. I was ashamed. It took me several years, and an equal number of people for me to complete my admission of my moral defects and sexual behavior completely. During this time, my spiritual growth was hampered by the secrets that I was still holding inside of me. The guilt that I felt concerning my sexual behavior came from pre-puberty days in a church that preached it was as bad to think it as it was to do it. My dating when I was 14-16 would sometimes lead to heavy petting and nearly sexual intercourse, but then I'd be overwhelmed with guilt and could not "perform". Thus I started believing that there was something wrong with me, that I wasn't normal, perhaps gay. I was totally engrossed with concern about my sexual inadequatcy.

At 19, I started drinking and having sex with any girl that was halfway willing. Trying to prove to myself that I was ok. A macho man. I used and abused young ladies, but I drank away the guilt; temporarily. When I married at 23, my sexual behavior was "normal", and continued that way for a couple of decades. As my disease progressed, I sought out sordid places and lower companions and I found them. Sex with them seemed to match the self loathing that was going on inside of me. I did things that I thought unthinkable 20 years prior.

I had several experiments with homosexual activy and sank to a lower point than I believed possible. I was not destroying my self fast enough with booze, I was using every resource available.

In 1985 when I first attempt to record my sexual behavior as a part of my fourth step, I could not put it on paper, and many of the incidents were not remembered at that time. As I worked more and more to be rigiorously honest, I wrote and remembered more. I thought I was so bad.

As I started sponsoring people and working with them, I began to realize that most of them were in the same perdictament as I had been. There were some things that simply were not going to be revealed. I learned that by sharing my past with them, that it allowed them to dump some of the garbage that otherwise would have remained with them.

I've attempted during my soberity, to openly address my sexual past, and thus help people to let go of their fear of being condemned. I have had dozens of men tell me that I was the only one that they'd ever heard talk openly about "me and cousin Joey playing with each other when we we 13".

So the reason that I proposed the topic is so that maybe someone will be relieved of the fear enough that they made be able to a searching and fearless moral inventory and not skit as many things as I did in my first attempts. At 60 years of age, I don't really much care what people think of my sexual past, but I do have a concern for the younger members of our fellowship that may carry guilt or shame unnecessarily.

I apoligize for the length of this post, and truly hope to help people and not offend them.

Your brother in recovery.


Member: Martha L.
Location: New Jersey
Date: 7/22/01
Time: 7:39:44 PM

Comments

I am new to this and my comment is not on above. Has anyone tried Antabuse? I have and find it extremely helpful, not being a God or step person. We must all use whatever helps. I am not deeply committed to the program becaue of several areas I do not approve of and experiences I have had over several years. Perhaps that will not be a popular statement but I must be true to myself. Comments welcomed.


Member: Barbara S, schenck@peoplepc.com
Location: Miami, FL
Date: 7/22/01
Time: 7:52:46 PM

Comments

Please accept my appology. My company just made it possible for me to own a new computer and I have never gone on line for an AA meeting. I have learned how to add you to my favorites.

I have 16 years unbroken years in AA in Miami. I am sure my adventures in the area of the aforementioned topic are virtually unriveled, but as my Sponsor told me so long ago keep your mind and direction aimed at recovery and off relationships and/or sex, untill you have a firm grasp of who you are and what you were. It has worked.


Member: Harry K
Location: U.K
Date: 7/22/01
Time: 8:14:01 PM

Comments

Hi all, Harry an alcoholic here.Sex? Hmmmm. A BIG problem for me as well. My sexual inventory during the 4th step was downright ugly. I hurt people and probably wrecked a couple of marriages, (mine included!) It would have been somewhat easier if I were able to blame it on alcohol but as I was told in the book, "Our liquor was a symtom, we had to get down to causes and conditions". And my condition was insecurity, self hatred,inadequacy and the need to feel good about myself by a "conquest" or two. The blessing today is I can look at the wreakage without the self loathing I used to experience, but I can honestly say I still have my moments of different scenes from long ago when I caused so much pain and heartache and still ask my God for the forgivness that years have not yet been able to erase. I'm married now and still need to watch my step. Transition for this alcoholic comes slow, and I need to be ever vigilant about insuring I practice the principal of integrity. I haven't the right to inflict such pain on my wife or anyone else in order to fill some emotional hole or gap in my person. My sobriety hangs in the balance today, and I'm no longer willing to jeapordise my marriage, my friendships and my relationship to God to fill it. I've been sober now for eight years, and I still have allot of work to do with myself towards loving the man I am and accepting the person that stares back at me in the mirror. I still on occation have bouts of unworthiness and fears of getting old. When this occurs my mind still reverts back to the deception that a "different woman" can get me out of it. That thought is just one example of some of the "old ideas" I can fall prey to if I don't maintain my spiritual condition on a daily basis as reminded in the 10th step.

That which has the power to heal also has the power to inflict. Sex is beautiful. It can heal. But if revert to my old patterns....... the infliction would far greater. Thanks Curtis, your not alone.


Member: Wm O
Location: Macks  Inn Id
Date: 7/22/01
Time: 11:42:37 PM

Comments

Hi I'm Bill alcoholic

Thanks Curtis I'll use my honorary apache name Lil Bstrd for this share. More anonomous that way.I stalled on my fith step because of that very reason. Sexual Drive for me especially through adolesence and young adult hood was a realy strong drive. I'd hesitate now in saying it was abnormal or unique.moraly wrong and motivated for self satisfaction wrong and in some cases obsesive.I fifth stepped sex with a guy not as far along inn the program as me. I took him with me to take a plaster cast of a grizzly bear with cub prints. We had a several mile hike I'd brought a 12gauge loaded with cracker shells. He kept watch while I played with the plaster of paris.

I't wasnt my intention although it had naged at me a long time. I just told him what I was doing and let it ripp.He didnt shoot me he shared his .Ive never done anything perfect and Im shure this wasnt either. However it got the pin in the pus .

I havnt done my fifth step with just one individual I spread it around to whomever I felt the most comfortable or the circumstance just felt okay.Any how enough about me thanks for letting me share.


Member: Cindy s
Location: MS
Date: 7/23/01
Time: 12:20:09 AM

Comments

cindy alcoholic, for me this is where step 4&5 are very imporant. the the big book says if i don't I may not get over drinking, i don't won't to go back there. first i have a good sponser. AS she pointed out we all have sex problems. Drinking just a systom. Longer i'm sober more is revealed that is where step 10 comes. I have to be honest with myself& others. sponsering others helps alot.


Member: Bruce G
Location:
Date: 7/23/01
Time: 1:55:49 AM

Comments

IB Bruce, alcoholic Curtis, for me, as I understand it, the purpose of the 4th step is to bring into visual reality those things that we may have done to harm others, or ourselves,emotionally, physically, or otherwise, and help us to determine and recognize the core character defects that allowed us to perform these acts, detrimental to others and ourselves. When we are "rigorously" honest with ourselves, and put these things down on paper, where we can see them and be confronted by them, we may then be able to begin to recognize our powerlessness over people, places, and things, and most importantly, our past powerlessness over "self" and our ability to choose how we acted. This may grant us a degree of humility with which to undertake the 5th step,where we can put humility into action in order to be granted more. I've heard very explicit, detailed 5th steps and also very uninformative, generalized 5th steps, BUT, as long as the essence of the transgression is revealed and it is clear to the the "stepper" the nature of his/her wrongdoing that has caused enough fear, guilt, pain, and remorse to cause him/her to deem it necessary to include it in their 4th/5th step, then the goal of the step concerning that transgression has been accomplished. Sordid details, names, dates, places, and specifics aren't absolutely necessary to the success of the 5th step. As Mike, above, said, the only thing required is honesty and thoroughness, but as long as we truly and honestly see for ourselves that we have indeed wronged another and are truly remorseful and understand the nature of our wrongdoing, then the 5th step has done its job. JMO ps...Martha, antabuse may keep you from drinking, but if you are a drunk like me, it won't get you sober! That takes a change in thinking. I always thought I was true to myself too...came to find out I didn't know who me was!


Member: Mark W.
Location: St. Louis
Date: 7/23/01
Time: 7:12:02 AM

Comments

Tough subject, says we all need it:) I have gone through four marriages. the last ended after my fifth sober birthday. Can't change the past, but can learn from it. Sex was part of the problem, as were many other things. Ex recently pointed out the pattern, which I knew, but refused to see. She and I are not communicationg regularly, but this tidbit, intended to hurt me, was of great value to me.

I am sober today, and need to be totally honest with others, but the myself is more important to my sobriety. I have broken the pattern that ex pointed out. Hope it does make for a better rest of life.

Curtis, thank you, your words of wisdom will be remembered and taken to heart. Yes, you have helped at least one.

Martha, last week here, was a discussion of "it". You may want to read that discussion, as you may decide to go to meetings. Antbuse works just fine until you decide to not take it so you CAN drink. Anyone who has manic-depressive disorder can tell you how that downfall is almost certain, as they have the same problem. The medicine works well, BUT the desire for the "up-time" eventually over rides sanity, and the meds go to waste. Well, the depressive side always comes, and they will admit that it wasn't worth it. This happens repeatedly to many with this problem. It is also called bi-polar disease today.

I am an alcoholic, I choose not to drink today. AA has saved the life I have, and for that I am grateful.

Mark W. LMW007@aol.com


Member: Clinton
Location:
Date: 7/23/01
Time: 9:58:48 AM

Comments

This subject is the core of 99% of my problems. I too spent my adolesence chasing sex and then pursued full-time fornication starting at age 19 and temporarily ceasing at 22 when I met my wife to be.

Eventually, I got myself into pornography and regular masturbation. This seemed to only increase the problem. This led to a few trips to strip clubs which then led to receiving a hand job from a stripper. The guilt of this got me and I told my wife about a week later. I wish I had never done this, but it was the bottom that got me into AA.

My wife now doesn't trust me and doesn't believe that I love her. I do love her but mabye I haven't known how to truly give myself in loving someone else. The guilt of this and the cumulative effect of sexual escapades can dominate my life at times these days. The previous answer was to drink and forget. Now I'm dealing with about 20 years of pent up emotions. I'm glad to be in AA today. I pray that I will be given the strength to continue to face these problems daily.


Member: Elizabeth
Location:
Date: 7/23/01
Time: 1:48:50 PM

Comments

When you have a relationship that is filled with drinking and partying then inevitebly sex will be had while drunk over and over. Soon you begin to feel that you need to be drunk to have sex. Feelings and emotions are hard to deal with sober. Sex is usually about letting go and losing yourself in another person. The problem with alcoholics though is that they drink to avoid their feelings usually. They don't want to waste time feeling, they just want another drink. I can remember just wanting to get sex over with so I could have another beer. How sick is that? I am trying to re-learn how to be intimate with my husband while sober. We have been so distanced from eachother, alot of bad stuff in the past. We are now trying to get healthy and I am having to learn how to open up to him. He has to learn how to be patient and kind, he has to learn how to be loving, not just when he wants to jump into bed. Learning, learning, learning. I guess this is what it is all about. Elizabeth


Member: Joe L.
Location: Phila, PA - USA
Date: 7/23/01
Time: 2:37:59 PM

Comments

Hi All; Joe here, definitely alcoholic.

CURTIS: Thanks for the topic.

MARTHA L: You may want to search "Secular recovery" - no God & no steps, I don't think. I've never heard anything negative about Antabuse except when people drank while on it. That's why most people won't take it, they're afraid of drinking and really messing themselves up.

I got sober at what was called a "fifth step group." It was an all men's clubhouse, all closed meetings except one open meeting a month. I wasn't in that clubhouse 5 minutes when I heard people share things I'd never heard before. They saved my life, but I realize it's not for everybody. I agree with the people that said "Take your time", and "Be sure about the person you're taking it with." I think piece meal is ok too. Whatever you have to do. Peace, Out - Joe L.


Member: Marriell
Location:
Date: 7/23/01
Time: 5:31:09 PM

Comments

I experienced sex both, drunk and sober.

It is a terrible waste of adrenaline while you are drunk.

Such a glorious sensation while sober!

As simple as that.

Marriell


Member: --
Location:
Date: 7/23/01
Time: 7:20:05 PM

Comments

I have never had sex sober.


Member: jose
Location: la
Date: 7/23/01
Time: 8:53:07 PM

Comments

i like to fuck big titties,women love it,then i finish by cumming in their mouth.they love it, right elizabeth?


Member: jose
Location: la
Date: 7/23/01
Time: 8:53:16 PM

Comments

i like to fuck big titties,women love it,then i finish by cumming in their mouth.they love it, right elizabeth?


Member: jose
Location: big dick,calif.
Date: 7/23/01
Time: 8:56:46 PM

Comments

clinton looks at playgirl at jacks his little 3 inch dick into a thimble.


Member: jose
Location: big dick,calif.
Date: 7/23/01
Time: 8:56:54 PM

Comments

clinton looks at playgirl at jacks his little 3 inch dick into a thimble.


Member: Jeff
Location:
Date: 7/23/01
Time: 11:22:35 PM

Comments

I'm sure they will pray for you, jose. If I could, I would also.


Member: Rita
Location:
Date: 7/24/01
Time: 1:11:42 AM

Comments

Hi everyone, Rita alcoholic. What a great topic. I am wrestling with the fourth step because I am 45 and in love with a 24 year old. I feel there is some kind of sick dynamic in this, but everytime I try to stop it, we just end up as we always do, talking to each other about all kinds of stuff. I want to break this off so that I can get on with my inventory and put some closure to my past. Any thoughts, comments or experience strength and hope would truly be a blessing thanks.


Member: Jack B
Location: Palo Alto, Pa
Date: 7/24/01
Time: 2:49:09 AM

Comments

Hi, I am Jack a real alcoholic.Sex comes under the seven deadly sins, we need to address in our 4th step.My sexual expectations were just like all my other character defects, completely out of proportion. I woke up many places, I had no right being. All my sexual activities was governed by lustful thoughts,actions, & self-centered fear. As we stay sober longer and immerse ourselves in the 12 step program of A A, we learn to live our way into sober thinking as opposed to thinking our way into sober living. God Bless and thanks for a great topic.


Member: The crazy world of Avril G
Location: Belgium via Barnsley UK
Date: 7/24/01
Time: 6:50:24 AM

Comments

Good topic, Curtis, and one we all need to look at, Thanks.

Marriel was right in her analogy, but as a drinker, I (ab)used sex to get me where I wanted to be, to get what I wanted. Only problem was, I expected every guy who jumped into MY bed to stay with me for life (or at least until I had got sick of them) I was the one who got hurt when THEY didn't conform.

Sex is a very powerful weapon, and I used it as such. Having suffered sexual abuse from the age of 12, I became an abuser myself (always with the guys' consent, of course, there were plenty of willing victims)

I often share in meetings that I have had quite a few husbands - THREE of them were my OWN!! I preyed on the married ones, I got wined, dined, laid and they got free sex (IF I wanted it - some got let down badly) BUT they didn't want commitment, which was good for me.

I am happy to say that thanks to the programme, and the help of other agencies nothing to do with AA, I have a wonderful loving, and totally fulfilling relationship. It is based on honesty, trust, love and understanding (AND great sex, best ever) I agree that it is THE big area where we all have one problem or other, yet it is ignored so much. Try putting it to your homegroup that the topic be 'Sex in Sobriety' I have done this twice, first time, none of the men turned up, apart from one, who was a visitor, and didn't know the theme, who left saying it was one of the best meetings he had ever been to, and was going to ask his homegroup to use this as a theme. The second one was packed with both sexes, and ran overtime, so much so, we decided to use this theme every 3 months or so.

Sex is as normal as eating, sleeping and breathing, so WHY is it such a taboo subject?? Why does the fact that (some) women openly admit to masturbation shock some people?? This is something we ALL instinctively know how to do even before we walk or talk!! (Ever had to stop a baby doing it in front of visitors??) LOL

Of course, it is the Jose's and the anonymous anal retentives who post crap who make sex the 'embarrassment' it has become, but we have to remember this and other places like it are for sick people trying to recovery, and some are much, much sicker than others.

goodallavril@yahoo.co.uk


Member: Me again
Location: DUUH
Date: 7/24/01
Time: 6:54:56 AM

Comments

oops, that's goodallavril2000@yahoo.co.uk (Just changed address)


Member: Bob R.
Location: Pa.
Date: 7/24/01
Time: 8:40:47 AM

Comments

Jose sounds a lot sicker than us who are battling alcohol.SO many hide behind a TV screen,guess they come from all over and squeeze in whenever and wherever they can? What is Antabuse,can anyone let me know at---bob52161@webtv.net, thank you!


Member: ss
Location: NYFN
Date: 7/24/01
Time: 9:02:43 AM

Comments

S, Alcoholic here. I wouldn't take antibuse cause it very harmful to your body. It holds in toxics, not allowing your body to detox, very determintal. Going to a weekly outpatient clinic and having to take a urine weekly is much safer. Please all, keep me in your prayers tonight, 7:15 p.m. eastern time for pardon and deliverance! I have 89 days today and feel good. Thanks for allowing me to have a place to talk about things. Thanks for letting me share. I have two thoughts for the day: Today's Inspiration:7/23

The journey of a thousand miles begins with one step. ______________________________________ Today's Inspiration:7/24

We never test the resources of God until we attempt the impossible


Member: Joe L.
Location: Phila,PA - USA
Date: 7/24/01
Time: 10:23:33 AM

Comments

CJ, ADRIANNA & MARK S: Welcome and God Bless You. I don't know about you, but I can only do this one day at a time. Today, Tuesday, as good or as bad as it is, this is the only day I've got. I must be sober. I can't handle it, it handles me. If you make staying sober the most important thing in your life - you'll make it. Thanks for being here. Peace, Out...


Member: Chris Ann O.
Location: North Carolina
Date: 7/24/01
Time: 1:04:07 PM

Comments

Hi, I'm new to this website although I have been going to AA meetings in town and out of town, not to crazy about listening to people that talk over and over again about their problems of drinking from years ago. I quit drinking Nov. 99 after finding out I had Cirrhosis of the Liver and Hepatitis C, drinking to me is not a problem anymore because I know if I drink I will die even sooner than they can even think of me getting a liver. Right now I'm still waiting to get on the liver list because they say I have to attend AA meetings first, I dont mind meeting people but I was never one to let all my feelings out to strangers, I'm hoping my Dr. in Chapel Hill will allow me to stay on the web for my part in this. Hmmmmm Sex? Since I've had this diagnosis I have been put on meds that make it pretty hard to even get the desire, I really feel for my fiance but you know what he stands by me totally. He loves me very much and vise versa, its so hard on him sometimes, not only the sex thing but just dealing with this company we started together and now he's just about doing everything on his own. He's a strong willed man and I thank God for that. God is my 1st rock, I do alot of praying, especially at night when I'm by myself. I do want to start getting more active in doing the l2 steps and traditions, they say that is a great help, you might think I don't know what I'm talking about but I really do NOT want another drink, I can't even stand being around anyone that does drink anymore, man to think I looked and acted that stupid, what a waste of so much time in my life and now I don't even have that much more to look forward to if I don't get a transplant soon. WHAT A FREAKIN WASTE, it really makes me mad when I think how stupid I was to just through away my life, now I have the best man and stepson and daughter a person could ask for and , well enough about me I hope I can continue to have talks with all of you and believe you me this is probably the most I've said since I've been going to AA meetings because I just didnt think it would thrill anyone to hear about my problems, Lucky You HA-Ha THANKS FOR LISTENING TO ME. Chris Ann


Member: Mark W.
Location: St. Louis
Date: 7/24/01
Time: 1:43:39 PM

Comments

Chris Ann,

I hope that you do get you liver. I hope as well that you do not ruin it with even more alcohol. The drunkalogs are not the only dialog at AA meetings. Neither of my parents were offered the opportunity to receive a new liver, so both died of self induced liver failure. I thought that those who had this problem self inflicted were not eligable for transplant. This is not a fast or pretty death. Most of my AA friends know of this part of my life. See, no drunkalog:) Mark W. LMW007@aol.com


Member: cristo777
Location: San Diego
Date: 7/24/01
Time: 2:33:35 PM

Comments

Boy, Curtis L. really opened up an incendiary topic! Brave! After reading everything above I must "come out of the closet." People like Barbara S. will tell everyone to keep it simple and be quiet about it, which one hears too often in AA. Curtis, on the other hand, is doing what I believe is the real, honest, brave work of deep, global recovery. And I know the kind of trouble Rita is in, I've gone out over obsessions with romantic partners.

Hey, I've figured out that it's not "I'm an alcoholic" OR "I'm an overeater" OR "I'm a codependent love addict." I'm one of the many people in AA who are cross-addicted. But not everyone has the courage, resources or ability, especially in the beginning, to accept that. It's taken me years. I'm in the process right now. My latest first and second steps are about powerlessness over more than alcohol. What I want to say is that I see a lot of other addictions slipping between the cracks of people who are staying sober from alcohol. Is overeating (if you're a compulsive overeater) or flirting with or even going out with newcomers (if you're a codependent or sex and love addict) practicing these principles in all our affairs? Is it really getting well and fulfilling all the potential our H.P. gave us? I first got sober in NYC, and there, people who work more than one program (once they have enough sober time under their belt) are called double or triple winners. I'm glad I saw those role models. It's been hard to look at everything - I've been doing it imperfectly, by degrees, which is probabably the only way to do it! But for me it's the only path - otherwise I'm lying to myself. For people who aren't newcomers, or whose other addictions are so severe their sobriety is being jeopardized, these other programs can be invaluable: Codependents Anonymous, Sex and Love Addicts Anonymous, Survivors of Incest Anonymous, and Overeaters or Food Addicts Anonymous. After observing people in meetings for 16 years I believe many of us are cross-addicted. For some, just staying sober may be all they can handle. But for others the deeper path is the way. Kudos to Curtis and the others who are trying to be thoroughly honest. You can find all the programs I mentioned on the Internet. I know this will be controversial to some, and I'm ceasing to care. As many have said, drinking is but a symptom for many of us. I want to have the courage to look at all of my disease, and to know true freedom. I think that's why God brought me to 12-step programs. Thanks.


Member: Anon.
Location:
Date: 7/24/01
Time: 3:07:06 PM

Comments

I hope you won't think I'm sick, but I must put this forth. I enjoy and encourage my partner to sleep with others. She has done this for me once or twice. I feel terribly guilty about it. You are the first I've ever admitted this to. I'm so ashamed.


Member: Anonymous
Location:
Date: 7/24/01
Time: 3:58:05 PM

Comments

"Sex" you say; Where I come from it is a marriage, it is a bond in itself. If sex is not considered such it is fornication or adultry depending on the status of the two involved, If either one of the two has ever been married it is adultry. Therefore the forth and fifth steps are designed to turn us from such relationships not expedient for us. These steps are there to point out the exact nature of our wrongs and according to the inventory we made, amend our ways. All this is done that we might be pleasing to God; in times past we gave no thought to his precepts, but now, having turned our wills and lives over to the care of God, it follows that we desire to conduct ourselves accordingly even towards the knowledge of his will for us and the power to carry that out. Of course if we have not yet figured out or read what God has layed down for us in his commandments then we are yet unlearned. Its rather difficult to do a forth and fifth step if we don't know the difference between yesterday and today....


Member: MARG
Location: CANADA
Date: 7/24/01
Time: 4:31:35 PM

Comments

WHY IS THE MEETING FROM JULY 15 - 21. THE DATE TODAY IS JULY 24??????


Member: Corey T
Location: Canada
Date: 7/24/01
Time: 4:41:54 PM

Comments

Ya know I think it all boils down to an inability to feel content or at peace in our own skin; this is what we must learn. Why we constantly search for "something else" to fill the gap or make us feel better, regardless if it is sex, money, booze, power,k food or whatever, it still brings attention to the fact that we fail to grasp any real serenity by "practicing these principles" and childishly demand that something else provide this feeling for us. The answers are right in front of our nose if we have the desire and honesty to look and act on those. Until then- you can have as much sobriety as your honesty and willingness to change allows you too. But to pretend to be confused about this issue is quite a dishonest leap indeed.


Member: scared girl
Location:
Date: 7/24/01
Time: 8:41:40 PM

Comments

Sex? god, i cant even think about it. I only have 6 months and i feel like i am losing my mind with each day that goes by. I am only in my early 20's but feel like i am on the verge of a nervous breakdown. I was attacked on my last night of drinking and drugging, and sex scares me. Everything scares me right now!!! I am 24 years old and lost EVERYTHING i had do to my addiction, but especially my self respect. I am working with a sponsor and am only on step 3. I am so scared of everything and my feelings and emotions and life in general, and really looking at myself. Sometimes i think it would be easier just to check out, PERMANENTLY. i cant numb the pain with drugs and alcohol anymore, and it just want stop. if there are any women who have any advice please help me! i know that everyone says the first year is rough, but maybe i am beyond help??? i dont know. life on life's terms is just hard when i am stuck with my brain.


Member: jose
Location:
Date: 7/24/01
Time: 9:59:38 PM

Comments

avril,

lets do some mutual masterbation together,you will love it.


Member: billybob
Location:
Date: 7/24/01
Time: 10:49:41 PM

Comments

i like oral sex


Member: BONNY M.
Location: Miami FL
Date: 7/25/01
Time: 12:05:32 AM

Comments

scared girl: I can really relate to you, you are not alone.I was attacked four years ago. Instead of getting psychological help, I did what I thought was a geographical cure. Moving to Miami did not help my state of mind. I have not had any kind of a social life since I have lived here, at least in the sexual sense. I have become extremely introverted. I used to go to meetings when I lived in New England all the time. Since moving to Florida, I am afraid to have sex,date or trust any man completely. I had a few slipups when I moved to Florida but have been sober now for over one and half years. I wish I could be the one to tell you that things will get better soon, it is very hard work and you must work the program and or get professional psychological help. feeling all the feelings without alcohol or drugs is extremely difficult but with someone to talk to it will get easier. I have been on able to attend meetings since moving to Florida, due to this fear of trusting men. This is the first time I saw this web site. I'd just got a computer last week. I am hoping this will help me, as I hope it will help you. Just know that there are many others with your same feelings and problems out there, if we all reach out to each other we can help each other. I am so glad I got to speak to you and everyone else this evening thank God we are here for each other. till next time, BONNY


Member: Jean-Claude T.
Location: Belgium
Date: 7/25/01
Time: 5:34:52 AM

Comments

My name is JC and I’m an alcoholic.

Never took antabuse myself, but all the shares of sober AA’s I’ve heard went “with antabuse I could not drink, with the program I don’t want to drink”.

I’ve been lucky, when I told my sponsor I was goin’ to take pen and paper and do my 4th step, he just answered “why don’t you come over, so we can do it together”. It sure removed some guilt, mind-rambling and dirt stirring of doing it by myself. We chatted for hours and the result was that I removed myo skelletons from the closet, that I knew myself a little better (specially the defects that “justified” my drinking and that I’ve tried to level since then) and that part of my 5th step was done at the same time.

Now let’s go for SEX! Thanks for the topic, Curtis, the mention of it in a meeting always brings a grin on some felllows’s faces and make some girls blush and move them bottoms in uneasiness. Why’s that? Because we’re conditionned by the society rules that provide the background of our social life. There are slight differences due to geographical location, religion, age, gender, ... but there is a general tendency to condemn sex and lust. There was a time when priests said, over here at least, that masturbation could get you deaf. Man, I should wear at least 4 hearing aids by now!! Older men with girlfriends half their ages is accepted (specially if the guy’s rich), but women with toy-boys is shameful. Why? Maybe because we consider sex as the dark side of love. Sexual practices like masturbation, pornography or even sometimes just enjoying sex between 2 consenting adults (not commited together by signing a paper in front of the mayor) are still considered bad and obscene. Why should a picture of my genitals be more shameful than one of my left foot?

I’ve been married for 22 years, 11 of them in booze. Never cheated on my wife, at 1st because alcohol took too much of my time, then, when I sobered up, because I knew I could never manage with the guilt of it (see? I’m conditionned too). On the sexual maintenance level I was not satisfied (so I took myself in hand), mainly because during those 11 years I was drinking, I annihilated every tentative of honest share and discussion with my wife (who already had a tendency to introversion). When I stopped, she didn’t change because I tried to change myself 24 hours at a time. There were things which were definitely broken between us, communication about our feelings and emotions was definitely one of them.

She died a little more than 1 year ago and I started a new relationship with a dear friend of mine in AA. We already had shared lots of feelings, emotions and parts of our lifes together and, when we got together, knew a lot about eachother. This relationship is mindblowing, because it’s a fusion of body and soul. It’s great sex, lust, love, care and communication. Should it be that we are soulmates? The fact is that we are 2 consenting adults and there are no taboos, nothing shameful. We meet and are satisfied on flesh and spiritual levels. Beyond my wildest dreams and, should I want to make a double-meaning statement, “the ride of my life”.

I am very grateful today and I thank you all for letting me share.

jctoller@hotmail.com


Member: Dave S
Location:
Date: 7/25/01
Time: 10:39:50 AM

Comments

TO: Member: Anonymous Location: Date: 7/24/01 Time: 3:58:05 PM

Regarding where you come from... where you come from and your concept of God or Higher Power (in the Big Book, Bill makes reference to his believing in God but also says that this is HIS belief) is just that... YOUR OWN... whatever works in our belief of "a Power greater than ourselves" is best left to the individual thus allowing us all to share one common bond... that being alcoholism. I can accept the fact that there are those who become "religiously oriented" and it's great to hear that it works FOR THEM but I also accept God "as I understand him" as a simple truth in the success in my sobriety and my serenity. BTW, Thanks Curtis your topic has helped me a lot... in my original post, I hadn't read your post correctly :-\


Member: jose
Location: la
Date: 7/25/01
Time: 2:16:01 PM

Comments

i like to watch women put on their strap-on-dildoes and do each other,its great


Member: AnilG
Location: Mt Vernon,IL
Date: 7/25/01
Time: 3:39:58 PM

Comments

I am alcoholic about sex I believe it is the adddiction as being an alcoholic. all addictions are bad and only your HP can help it. I have this problem and I a still working on it as i am powerless over it just like alcohol.


Member: cleo
Location: n.carolina
Date: 7/25/01
Time: 5:17:19 PM

Comments

the penis rules


Member: Al
Location: CO
Date: 7/25/01
Time: 5:37:40 PM

Comments

Al, an alcoholic here. Scared girl, I've been through some very rough times in sobriety that felt just impossible and horrible to deal with. All I can say is that you can get through that stuff, one day at a time. Keep working with your sponsor, going to as many meetings as you can, and stepping through the muck, and eventually you'll be out of the mud and on the other side. Checking out is a terminal solution to a temporary problem that solves nothing. Try to keep things simple, and stick with the women who offer you their experience, strength, and hope. You can make it, all it takes is a bit of faith to live through and work through that stuff. I know it is hard, but you can make it!

Oh, and on the topic, okay, we all have sex problems, and wouldn't be very human if we didn't. Too much or too little is not as much of an issue for me these days as it once seemed to be, but one area is one for me not to forget, and that is words from my sponsor who said, "if your sexual appetites cause harm to others or yourself, then do what is necessary to complete a 9th step amend on the issue."

Denial of sex related compulsion is easy to come by, as sex repression is supported by social norms in many countries. A thorough and fearless 4 step sex inventory and an honest 5th step with a sponsor about such matters helps deal with resulting guilt, anger, or fear. One thing that seems to help is for me to try and help others, especially in spring when attractions and hormones run high, as this gets me out of my self indulgence physical and mental states. Feeling guilty about being a sexually active person seems to be quite common. Generally, younger people have higher sex drives, and more hormones, than do older people. The best suggestion I can offer, and I'm not much of an expert, is to suggest asking your higher power for guidance in such matters before acting on desires, and be willing to listen and wait for guidance.

Love and intimacy are complex topics of which I cannot tell anyone else how to live. Sex is also an expression of love, not just lust. However, one thing for sure is that sex is a powerful urge, and like alcohol, can become addictive, but so can loosing or gaining weight for some people. So my best advice is that if it bugs you, pray about it, write about it, discuss it, and resolve the harm, if there is any.

On a more general note, there are always contrary opinions about this topic. Some say do it more and some say do it less. Only you'll know for sure. If you're out of control in this area, and you'll know if you are, as an honest inventory reveals the truth, deal with it.

If you need to clean up your side of the street do it, if not, enjoy life.


Member: Al
Location: CO
Date: 7/25/01
Time: 6:51:45 PM

Comments

Al here. I re-read my post and saw some wording that was confusing, and is better stated as follows:

…Too much or too little is not as much of an issue for me these days as it once seemed to be, but I try to remember what my sponsor said, "if your sexual appetites cause harm to others or yourself, then do what is necessary to complete a 9th step amend on the issue."

Keep what you want and leave the rest!


Member: sister ignatia
Location: the convent
Date: 7/25/01
Time: 10:05:53 PM

Comments

your all perverts


Member: Doug E.
Location: Richmond, VA
Date: 7/26/01
Time: 10:29:05 AM

Comments

Doug here, alcoholic. Motives, honesty, God-given, and balance. These are the words that come to mind. The original reference, I recall, was with respect to 4th/5th steps. Where have we been selfish, have we broken a promise or betrayed a trust? The instincts are God-given, but they have a purpose. When my instinct here "gets out of balance" and I focus on it to the point where I become selfish, then I am not as able to do God's will for me, I can't recieve his guidance because my mind is clogged up with me-me-me and I want-I want-I want. On a practicle note, it has been suggested to me that when my partner is not "in the mood", to accept that she has that right, and go take care of things myself if that is what it takes to clear my mind. I have found it to be helpful.

thanks for keeping me sober. this was first, but certainly not my last, visit to the on-line meeting.


Member: Hermit the frog
Location:
Date: 7/26/01
Time: 5:50:52 PM

Comments

Why be-labour the point? I say we do; Let's change the topic before we all croak.


Member: pam m
Location:
Date: 7/26/01
Time: 6:40:52 PM

Comments

Hermit the FROG, I agree l00% to change the subject and to talk about sobriety and to share our experience strength and hope with eachother. This topic I feel is a bit to harsh for a newcomer to absorb. I am forever grateful for being sober a day at a time! Pam M


Member: pam m
Location:
Date: 7/26/01
Time: 6:41:43 PM

Comments

Hermit the FROG, I agree l00% to change the subject and to talk about sobriety and to share our experience strength and hope with eachother. This topic I feel is a bit to harsh for a newcomer to absorb. I am forever grateful for being sober a day at a time! Pam M


Member: pam m
Location:
Date: 7/26/01
Time: 6:41:47 PM

Comments

Hermit the FROG, I agree l00% to change the subject and to talk about sobriety and to share our experience strength and hope with eachother. This topic I feel is a bit to harsh for a newcomer to absorb. I am forever grateful for being sober a day at a time! Pam M


Member: pam m
Location:
Date: 7/26/01
Time: 6:41:51 PM

Comments

Hermit the FROG, I agree l00% to change the subject and to talk about sobriety and to share our experience strength and hope with eachother. This topic I feel is a bit to harsh for a newcomer to absorb. I am forever grateful for being sober a day at a time! Pam M


Member: gwen b.
Location: Dallas, TX
Date: 7/26/01
Time: 6:44:42 PM

Comments

I have had a few relationships in sobriety and although there were enjoyable aspects to all, they sure did complicate my life and interfere somewhat with my program. I have come to understand, through continuing to work the STEPS that it is because of my addictive personality. I have a tendency to use sex. relationships, and anyting else that feels good as a substance. Therefore, I ignore my intuitive waarning signs that something is harmful to me or unacceptable until I begin to get resentments and realize that I am shutting myself off of the sunlight of the SPIRIT, and insanity is beginning to return to my life. As a result of this I have chosen to be celibate, one day at a time for about a year and a half now. If anyone had told me I would do this 3 yers ago, I would have told them they were "full of it". I am amazed myself, just as I am amazed to have continued to be granted a daily reprieve from my disease for all this time. God is good all the time.


Member: Chris H.
Location: FLa.
Date: 7/26/01
Time: 8:18:49 PM

Comments

Chris here--alcoholic/addict/bulimic To scared girl...hang in there girl!!You are definitely NOT alone. Many of us have had the feelings you are having, even if if we haven't had the exact same experiences. YOu are difinitely on the right track , and it WILL get better. It may take alot of hard work , but it is difinitely possible. We are all living testimonies to that.---Humm-- sex and the forth step. THe forth and fifth steps were difinitely the hardest steps for me, and the parts that included sex were the hardest . I think that the reason that they were the hardest was because of the shame that went along with them. I was so oshamed of what I had or had not done that I could hardly speak about it. HOwever, when i got the courage to tell some one about it , I had fantastic relief . To this day , when I have the courage to tell a trusted someone ( usually my sponsor or my therapist) about my faults or failings , I continue to get serenity. It comes under the heading of self-honesty.... I am really strugling right now...mabey there is something I need to " come clean" about. Sometimes I feel like I take two steps forward and two or three steps back. I haven't been able to get to this sight for a couple of weeks.. mabey that is part of my problem. I am surley looking forward to the day when I can make ftof meetings . there is such health in "the rooms " for me. here's to waithing around until the miricle happens!!


Member: Mike
Location: Minnesota
Date: 7/26/01
Time: 9:05:31 PM

Comments

I'm 47 years old and a few days short of two years sober. I'm also a few years out of a marriage that lasted about 15 years. I was faithful throughout.

So...during my 20's was when I dated regularly. What I can recall is that I had some inhibitions, fears, reservations and the like when it came to sex with a woman the first time. Would I perform well enough? Would it be pleasant or would I not really like the woman or still be attracted to her the next day?

The first date frequently amounted to going to a bar, drinking and then trying to summon up the courage when it seemed as if there was some type of connection. Now I can see that the drinking was about supressing the uncomfortable feelings that I had. I used drinking as a substitute for making an intimate connection from the heart.

Today, the program of alcoholics anonymous has allowed me to develop an ideal about my sexual behavior. Sex is a very intimate, close, revealing and wonderful experience. It's a gift. I can't say that I've had many relationships that have lead to sex in sobriety because I believe that I need to connect as a friend, first. I need a connection from the heart. And I need a spiritual connection.

If my daily reprieve is conditioned on the maintenance of my spiritual condition, my sexual encounters must have a spiritual aspect as well. If I am going to put my life into the spritual flow of things, my sex conduct must be there as well.


Member: billybob
Location: chico calif
Date: 7/26/01
Time: 10:57:31 PM

Comments

pam m

would you like to touch my penis a while?


Member: Don
Location: NH
Date: 7/26/01
Time: 11:59:11 PM

Comments

Longest web meeting ever, it would appear. SEX is popular topic. If you have trouble getting honest regarding sex in your 4th and 5th step, maybe you'd be a candidate for Sexaholics Anonymous. Check out www.sa.org, and see if you can identify. Sex good. Lust without bounds, not good. For me. 12 yrs w/o a drink. Still have a hard time with lust, and thats not the same as sex with my wife.


Member: Kathy
Location: Northeast
Date: 7/27/01
Time: 4:12:22 AM

Comments

Kathy - alcoholic

I agree about harshness of subject matter this week. Let's remember we have lots of newcomers reading these posts.

As for my sobriety I am so grateful to be celebrating my 16th anniversary today. Thank God for those who came into the Program before I did and were there to help and guide me. They loved me until I could love myself - they held me when I cried - they listened to my "yet buts" - they kept givng me encouragement - kept answering all the questions. Because they worked their Program as laid out in the Big Book I have stayed sober all these years. I can now share my experience, strength and hope with newcomers. I am SO grateful to have been given this new way of life.

Thank you all for being here.

God bless.


Member: Kathy
Location: Northeast
Date: 7/27/01
Time: 4:12:28 AM

Comments

Kathy - alcoholic

I agree about harshness of subject matter this week. Let's remember we have lots of newcomers reading these posts.

As for my sobriety I am so grateful to be celebrating my 16th anniversary today. Thank God for those who came into the Program before I did and were there to help and guide me. They loved me until I could love myself - they held me when I cried - they listened to my "yet buts" - they kept givng me encouragement - kept answering all the questions. Because they worked their Program as laid out in the Big Book I have stayed sober all these years. I can now share my experience, strength and hope with newcomers. I am SO grateful to have been given this new way of life.

Thank you all for being here.

God bless.


Member: Danny w
Location: France
Date: 7/27/01
Time: 5:47:44 AM

Comments

Hi, the the first time i'm online for a meeting I live in France where there are only é meetings a week in my town, I'm 18 and I just got back froma slip and I need a meeting everyday. I'm glad to be here


Member: Elizabeth
Location:
Date: 7/27/01
Time: 12:35:31 PM

Comments

It is Friday! The words are beginning to swirl in my head. " You can have a few tonight", "it has been a long week", "you deserve it" over and over again. 11 days sober today. I have no problem during the week but the week-end is a different story. Feeling blue today. Lot's of stress with the kids lately. Kinda feel like I want to scream. Well, back to work. Thanks for listening. Elizabeth


Member: Mark W.
Location: st. Louis
Date: 7/27/01
Time: 4:33:58 PM

Comments

Elizabeth, Don't do it. Think it through. The results were bad in the past, or you would not be here. Saturday mornings were my worst times in the past. I can relate to the desire after a hard week, BUT not today. So tomorrow you have yet one more twenty four hours to go through. Some are tougher than others, but ALL can be lived through. ODAAT

Mark W. LMW007@aol.com


Member: Val P
Location: Vancouver B.C.
Date: 7/27/01
Time: 5:06:09 PM

Comments

Sex and sobriety, a more appropriate topic for me right now there isn't. I am on hols in my old hometown - first time back in 4 years, and have been struggling with the calls of both those demons. I've been sober 2 years and 9 months and 9 days (who's counting?!!!)...but I am taking today one hour at a time. I have had some startling ghosts leap out of the recesses here - items/events/actions I "forgot" when I did my 4th/5th Steps a while ago... A lot of strong emotions/guilt surfaced and I started reacting/avoiding emotions. I realize my disease is still waiting to leap into action and reel me back into the mire that was my life. I tried a geographical cure, and slept with a lot of less than stellar men to try to fill that emptiness and quiet the feelings of worthlessness. I'm sooo grateful I found this site! And that I am sober right now.


Member: Pam m
Location:
Date: 7/27/01
Time: 6:13:29 PM

Comments

Thanks everyone for an excellent AA meeting! I truly am grateful for all the comments and topics that have been discussed. Elizabeth, Congratulations on your ll days sobriety. Keep up the good work, and remember that this is a gift, and stress will pass. Pam m


Member: Anonymous
Location:
Date: 7/27/01
Time: 6:46:57 PM

Comments

"Lets talk about sex; what a barrier it is in the forth and fifth steps." Nay; lets talk about sex; what a barrier it is to the forth dimension. Know ye not, that your bodies are a temple of the Lord? Or is it, that your emplying God, rather than God employing you. What I mean is: Are you ready to surrender, or is it that your asking for re-inforcements!? It's not like God to come down from his lofty place in heaven to assist those who cannot or will not admit they have to throw in the towell.

But let's talk about sex, is it bad? Nay its part of his creation, that we should go forth and multiply; that we should leave father and mother, and be joined to a wife; The marriage bed therefore is to be left sacred. But the question is: are we where we are placed in AA? Or, to put it this way: Is the marriage bed to be "made" sacred? Or, are we at that point to where the marriage bed is to be "left" sacred? There is a difference between making a marriage bed sacred and leaving a marriage bed sacred. The program bids us to consider: are we making or leaving.

Those of us who have left all to follow are also among those who have left even the marriage bed behind for God; For we have thus seen, that in times past it was expedient for us to think in terms of this life, but now, having come of age, we set our objective even higher even to the forth dimension which requires us to abandon completely. This place of comeing of age speaks in terms of children being grown up and, of being born again, no longer do we consider ourselves as we once did. If this is not the place you find yourself in perhaps, AA is yet in your future, seeing then that you have much yet in the here and now to live out let us talk about those who come to the program yet wanting to marry and be given in marriage.

Why stay here anylonger? You have much yet to live out before you are ready to leave the flesh, and God hath given each one of us to experience both the former and the later. It is not you, that have come to AA, but AA that has been thrust on you; It's before the time I say if you are not ready to let go of life and let God be your all in all; then know, that its too soon to buy a grave site when your ready to marry, and its too soon to marry when your just now getting started from your youth up, and its too soon to get started when your still going to school....


Member: Peter R UGGIERI Jr.
Location: 36miles south of Pittsburgh Pa.
Date: 7/27/01
Time: 8:16:41 PM

Comments

hi i.m pete a greatful recovering alcoholic i,ve been sober 15yrs and7 months thanks to aa


Member: LJJ
Location: the rez
Date: 7/27/01
Time: 11:09:02 PM

Comments

Hi, my name is Loretta, and I'm an alcoholic. Thanks to my higher power, people such as you, I have not had to drink or drug since June 9, 1982. This is my first time at an online meeting and I thought the topic was appropros. It has always worked that way for me in the program. I'm placed in places, and with those people, who say the things I need to hear...Truly, this is a case of me not being in control! Anyway, I just wanted to share that today I have been working on my self-hatred, and now that I have listened to most of you, it seems that my past sexual acting out was integrally related to my self hatred. I am slowly learning to love myself again. But it is one the hardest things I've had to do in this program of recovery. My old sponsor used to tell me to stop beating myself up so much. It finally sunk in....so thanks to all of you for your honesty. Peace and love!


Member: gwen b.
Location: dallas,TX
Date: 7/27/01
Time: 11:35:32 PM

Comments

I for one would like to know if "anonymous from ? is a frustrated wannbe preacher or just another "born again "AA guru , who sounds like


Member: Garth T
Location: FL
Date: 7/28/01
Time: 8:34:39 AM

Comments

Hi im garth and im an alcoholic

sex is not a barrier to the fourth and fifth steps. your feelings of how moral or immoral your sexual activities are need to be decided in those steps. if those activities fall on the side of the later see steps 6 and 7.


Member: pam m
Location:
Date: 7/28/01
Time: 12:25:06 PM

Comments

Hi All, I'm Pam definite alcoholic! I am grateful to AA and this program for opening up my eyes to this disease. It is not only drinking but many issues that must be faced in order to recover. thats all for now.


Member: Lowrider
Location:
Date: 7/28/01
Time: 2:37:15 PM

Comments

Whew!!...here it all goes again: Reading all the replys above about the subject it is clear to me why the BB page 70 goes on to say; We realize that some people are as fanatical about sex as others are loose. We avoid hysterical thinking or advice. For me it's a fine line between what I was told was the right idea and what I have done with my sex life. In other words if I leaned toward what seemed the right, clean and true way I wasn't happy..then by going the other way (kiny thoughts and actions) I would burn with guilt..so much so that I felt I was not worthy of Gods love and that I was an "AA failure"...this thinking would then lead to a "ticket out" in which I did not feel I fit into AA. I would then shy away from AA. I had almost 9 years sobriety and finally using my "ticket out" really did go back out and stayed out for 2 years. I drank again and always reflected back at the AA do gooders and how I fell. I realize now this was just an excuse to continue drinking. I may never get what others see as a perfectly clean sex life as some say they have...(I've even heard some say they don't even lust anymore) I don't think I will ever get that saintly (wish I could) but that just isn't me. My main goal now is to not bring harm to people with my own idea of how I think my sex life should be. One thing for certain though I will not allow my self to fall into that trap I was in before by thinking I was not worthy of AA because my sex life was not as pure as some seemed to make theirs. All the best to everyone and thanks for being here so I could be here!


Member: jose
Location:
Date: 7/28/01
Time: 3:55:45 PM

Comments

when i rub my penis it gets soooooooo big.


Member: ?!
Location:
Date: 7/28/01
Time: 6:23:23 PM

Comments

Now How could anyone in his right mind belive that the above post and the sick mind thereof hath turned his will and life over to the care of God?


Member: Anon
Location: USA
Date: 7/28/01
Time: 6:28:44 PM

Comments

Okay, jose. I'll bite (pardon the pun) How big?


Member: jerry j
Location: so cal
Date: 7/28/01
Time: 10:12:45 PM

Comments

jerry alcoholic Welcome to the newcomers. It's always good to talk about the steps. When I came to AA I was too sick to understand the process of recovery. I did not know what it was to be free from the wreckage of my past. I had many areas of my life that I hid away for reasons of guilt, shame, fear, etc. I believe it is called "stinking thinking". What I have been taught here is to use the steps for myself, to clear away the things that block ME from the sunlight of the spirit. I have also been taught that those who would be concerned with the details of my inventory are better left out of my life. The ones that matter in my life are concerned for my recovery. What a gift! Only because I kept coming back and not drinking one day at a time have I been able to learn these things. My son is eleven and has never seen me take a drink. That's a miracle for me! I am still learning how to apply these principles to my life. I am still coming back one day at a time. I still don't drink one day at a time. Thanks for the topic. God bless