Member: Kelly
Location: Kansas
Date: 6/22/2003
Time: 7:24:27 AM

Comments

GOOD advice from 4 God's sake as quite frankly Andrew while yeah there's some interesting "discussion" over various topics around here, that as an excuse for why you drank again ranks right up there with ALL the other ones as STUPID, STUPID, STUPID! There is NO reason for anyone who comes here to ever drink and that is understood by all, regardless of what their "point of view" may be on any other various topic. Obviously you never reached that basic, simple place in your 5 brief months of sobriety. Listen, I'm not giving you a hard time, I'm only saying YOU and YOU ALONE are the one to blame after a SMALL taste of sobriety and drinking again, so don't go around making excuses as that's all they are, whatever they are. We all wish you well, but this site is not what matters as it is just a web-site and not real life. If you're really looking for help get to "real meetings" as that's where it's at, not here! Although there is some good variety here, even the RR'ers generally support abstinence, so say what you want, but in the end they are going to do more of the same. Thus you've basically got two choices, take it like 4 God's sake said(tounge-in-cheek) or take every little thing seriously and of course anyone is going to get upset over something someone says at some point as there are some "different" points on here and even in f2f meetings too. But whatever, God Bless ya man, keep at it!!!!!!!!!!


Member: liz s.
Location: florida
Date: 6/22/2003
Time: 7:50:51 AM

Comments

i'm going to assume (perhaps incorrectly) that the topic under discussion is DON'T DRINK IF YOUR ASS FALLS OFF OR TURNS TO GOLD AND GO TO FTF MEETINGS. well, i don't know about yu all, but i have to stick to the basics so i don't have to go back to them one day: go to ftf meetings, ask for help, work with others and don't drink or use. i have to harness my unchained will to my Higher Power's sometimes, in order to do the right thing, but so far, it's worked for me. i go to meetings when i'm not in the mood, work with others even when i'm not in the mood, pray to the invisible to help me accomplish the impossible (yu guessed it, even when i'm not in the mood) - and today i do have a life i only dreamed of, sitting around on barstools for over 25 years. all due to Not Drinking and the way i don't drink, on a daily basis, is by practicing what AA has taught me, not without a few knocks on the head and knuckling noogies and of course, meetings meetings meetings. happy 24 to all.....


Member: Sito T.
Location: Vega Baja, Puerto Rico
Date: 6/22/2003
Time: 8:40:18 AM

Comments

You can't solve a problem unless you admit you have a problem. Sounds simple, right? I had the opportunity to relapse in the past, and as I look back maybe I thought that maybe I wasn't alcoholic enough, and I had to burn my hands some more. The bottom line is, that I'm Sito and I'm an alcoholic that cannot take a drink like normal people. Going to meetings, not taking that first drink, and working the steps has helped me overcome this obsession that someday I'll be able to handle my alcohol consumption. 24 hours of sobriety to all and God bless.


Member: L-RAY
Location: SCOTLAND
Date: 6/22/2003
Time: 10:05:36 AM

Comments

Hi everyone dont drink go to meets get a sponser and get the steps into your life! that what i was told when i first came to A.A.i had the desire to stop and i was willing to go to any lengths to stay sober! that was 15th sept 1986 havnt needed a drink since this works if you really want it ! regards L-RAY


Member: Kerry
Location: Baltimore
Date: 6/22/2003
Time: 10:26:56 AM

Comments

How bout spirituality as an added topic as everyone will talk about what they want to anyways, just like at f2f meetings, eh? Anyways, will people please tell me about their God as I really do want to hear about Him/Her/It/Whatever????????


Member: cb
Location: usa
Date: 6/22/2003
Time: 10:31:00 AM

Comments

HEllow everybody still working on me thing are getting better. I can say buy words of in myself to list to understanding people get better in our lifes today . I stay away from my trobble today god in


Member: cb
Location: usa
Date: 6/22/2003
Time: 10:31:12 AM

Comments

HEllow everybody still working on me thing are getting better. I can say buy words of in myself to list to understanding people get better in our lifes today . I stay away from my trobble today god in


Member: Kim V
Location: kvaughn@madison.main.nc.us
Date: 6/22/2003
Time: 10:33:03 AM

Comments

Kim V here alcohlic. For me I have to remember not everyone is ready to get sober or to go to any lengths especially when they find out what those any lengths are. I always put my email address on my comments and from time to time get people who email desperate for help. We email back in forth a few weeks. I tell them to get a big book read the first 43 pages over and over until they can tell me why Jim did not have any defense against the first drink. They can never stick with me long enough to figure that one out. Now if you been in recovery very long and read your Big book you know the answer to that right? Then I tell them they have to go to real live meetings. I get all these reasons of why the can't. People will find out etc. Then I point out that the guy at the liquior store knows them by their first name and everybody alreadys they drink too much anywayand that people just don't care and they know it isn't any of their business. Now because I will not wallow in self pity with them etc. I usually stop hearing from them shortly thereafter. Don't get me wrong I share my experience, strength and hope. My 5 years in prison, my losing my kid, getting her back and just having celebarated 7 years clean and sober. But even with all the ones who are NOT READY TO GO TO ANY LENGTHS< one day there will be one, that will GET IT and MAKE IT, and that makes it worth it. This also helps me more than it helps them as it keeps me sober. So I don't beg anyone to do things my way. So Kelly stay on Andrews Ass and good for you for not accepting his bullshit answers for why he drank. He sure didn't call anyone first or go to a meeting, now did he?


Member: cb
Location: usa
Date: 6/22/2003
Time: 10:48:03 AM

Comments

TOday have you save burning fire . today I gave It to my high power I don't use people to get some for not to harm people in any way to give something in return what makes the word go around helping you people to stay my life today is better I'm tried of all money in something could had fifteen year a go be cause of you see.today ten mouth is not much in just


Member: cb
Location: usa
Date: 6/22/2003
Time: 10:49:37 AM

Comments

TOday have you save burning fire . today I gave It to my high power I don't use people to get some for not to harm people in any way to give something in return what makes the word go around helping you people to stay my life today is better I'm tried of all money in something could had fifteen year a go be cause of you see.today ten mouth is not much in just


Member: Kelly M
Location: NH
Date: 6/22/2003
Time: 11:27:13 AM

Comments

Hi ((Kerry S)), I hope you don't mind me posting what you wrote last night. I could relate with it so much I saved it! I had a busy day with a 22nd anniversary of my home group, making food for it and spending the day with my boyfriend...I was toast when I got home. This morning I am rested and wondering what the topic is this week? Kelly mentions anothers post that must be from yesterday about someone feeling sorry for themself. That their reasons for drinking were stupid. My reasons were like you said out of trying incorrectly to deal with abuse. Now I accept my end of the responsibility of some of the abuse I let myself take. I don't think my experience is stupid and I do know that I never drank for fun it was to bury and tune it out. Fade to black, so to speak. It was what is was and now I live sober and deal with things and I don't take crap anymore because it is all I feel I deserve. I have choices today. I choose to treat myself with respect and expect it from those close to me. I am no longer a victim full of self pity but pro active in my recovery and life. Sorry if this is off topic but I wanted to just say thanks for your post and I could definately relate.... Kelly .>>> Name: Kerry S: Again! Location: Down Under Date: 6/21/2003 Time: 8:01:05 PM Comments: ((( Yvonne ))) Reading your post got me thinking about the way in which we keep going back to people who have abused us. I had that pattern all my life, and into early sobriety. In Alanon they used to say, 'You can't get an apple from a lemon tree!' But even though I understood that intellectually, I kept going back to try. My first step on the road to recovery was that when I did find myself copping yet another serve of abuse, a little glimmer of awareness would surface: 'Hey this is not an apple tree, remember!' And I would extricate myself somehow and go nurse my wounds, usually with caring, nurturing members of the Fellowship in attendance. But over the years I got so frustrated with the whole deal I became 'entirely ready' to see how my own defects fed into the system. What I discovered was that often there was a pattern. Some situation would get my low self esteem going, I'd feel worthless, and would gravitate to people who would give me an emotional beating up, to reinforce my low opinion of myself. In other words, I used other people as part of my own self-abuse cycle. Having an awareness of the problem didn't make it go away overnight, of course, but it gave me another tool. When I found myself copping a serve from one of these people, I would remind myself, 'What did you come to this person again, you KNOW from experience what will happen!' Gradually, I stopped looking for people to beat me up, not to say there haven't been volunteers over the years, and still are today, but I culled the numbers considerably. You have had so much good ES&H on the issue from others here that I won't go into it any further. Just thought I would post this angle on the problem, since I don't recall anyone covering it yet. Love and butterflies KAS


Member: SNAKE RIVER JON
Location: AZ
Date: 6/22/2003
Time: 1:53:10 PM

Comments

i m jon i m alcoholic after more than 3 decades in and around aa i have experianced many miracles and coincedances , the biggest 1 being today the Compulsion to drink booze or do druGs has left me. this is through the power of the fellowship of alcoholics anonymous, and the grace of GOD. 4 those of u who feel it necisary to try to answer the question of y a drunk drinks perhaps u may care to read the 12x12 , if i have to explaine u will not understand, but i can safely assure 1 that if u donot take the 1st drink u cannot get drunk. if u have anyother question, (how do i not take the 1st drink ) then u r wasting our time. oh by the way it is easyer to show u that to tell u, YOU CAN ALWAYS TELL AN ALCOHOLIC,(BUT NOT MUCH) AA LOVE & SERVICE SNAKE RIVER JON


Member: d-flat
Location: fargo
Date: 6/22/2003
Time: 3:38:42 PM

Comments

good one jon! keep comin back!,,, whats the topic,, maybe i should read the posts? i hate following directions,,,hahahaha


Member: Jay C.
Location: Heaven
Date: 6/22/2003
Time: 6:55:35 PM

Comments

Hi Kerry . Spirituality ? I seem to think only two choices exist. . Find it or talk about it. You can't have both. Peace.


Member: ace
Location: full deck
Date: 6/22/2003
Time: 8:12:05 PM

Comments

I think this site will hurt you more than help you go to the meetings to many jokers when you want to play you throw the jokers out THANKS ACE


Member: DB
Location: KC
Date: 6/22/2003
Time: 8:18:39 PM

Comments

I am an Alcoholic, regards to the slip. just renewal your efforts and trust in God and clean House, Just do the deal and follow our path, you will get the results you are looking for just keep looking dont be discouraged.


Member: kimberley
Location: woodland
Date: 6/22/2003
Time: 8:50:29 PM

Comments

hello kimberley here recovering alcholic, what i have learned is that there is always a re before the lapse, and that you are the one who takes the first drink the steps are there to guide you so you have tools not to take the first drink, we have only one do not in the whole book, and it says DO NOT BE DISCOURAGED, keep coming back this too =shall pass, also pick up the dam phone there are people out there on the other end.


Member: Al K. Holic
Location: LaLa L@nd
Date: 6/22/2003
Time: 8:51:03 PM

Comments

WAITRESS comes over to the table. She has the check, and a pot of coffee. WAITRESS Can I get anybody more coffee. JOE No, we're gonna be hittin it. I'll take care of the check. She hands the bill to him. WAITRESS Here ya go. Please pay at the register, if you wouldn't mind. JOE Sure thing. WAITRESS You guys have a wonderful day. They all mutter equivalents. She exits and Joe stands up. JOE I'll take care of this, you guys leave the tip. (to Mr. White) And when I come back, I want my book back. MR. WHITE Sorry, it's my book now. JOE Blonde, shoot this piece of shit, will ya? Mr. Blonde shoots Mr. White with his finger. Mr White acts shot. Joe exits. NICE GUY EDDIE Okay, everybody cough up green for the little lady. Everybody whips out a buck, and throws it on the table. Everybody, that is, except Mr. White. NICE GUY EDDIE C'mon, throw in a buck. MR. WHITE Uh-uh. I don't tip. NICE GUY EDDIE Whaddaya mean you don't tip? MR. WHITE I don't believe in it. NICE GUY EDDIE You don't believe in tipping? MR. PINK (laughing) I love this kid, he's a madman, this guy. MR. BLONDE Do you have any idea what these ladies make? They make shit. MR. WHITE Don't give me that. She don't make enough money, she can quit. Everybody laughs. NICE GUY EDDIE I don't even know a Jew who'd have the balls to say that. So let's get this straight. You never ever tip? MR. WHITE I don't tip because society says I gotta. I tip when somebody deserves a tip. When somebody really puts forth an effort, they deserve a little something extra. But this tipping automatically, that shit's for the birds. As far as I'm concerned, they're just doin their job. MR. BLUE Our girl was nice. MR. WHITE Our girl was okay. She didn't do anything special. MR. BLONDE What's something special, take ya in the kitchen and suck your dick? They all laugh. NICE GUY EDDIE I'd go over twelve percent for that. MR. WRITE Look, I ordered coffee. Now we've been here a long fuckin time, and she's only filled my cup three times. When I order coffee, I want it filled six times. MR. BLONDE What if she's too busy? MR. WHITE The words "too busy" shouldn't be in a waitress's vocabulary. NICE GUY EDDIE Excuse me, Mr. White, but the last thing you need is another cup of coffee. They all laugh. MR. WHITE These ladies aren't starvin to death. They make minimum wage. When I worked for minimum wage, I wasn't lucky enough to have a job that society deemed tipworthy. NICE GUY EDDIE Ahh, now we're getting down to it. It's not just that he's a cheap bastard-- MR. ORANGE --It is that too-- NICE GUY EDDIE --It is that too. But it's also he couldn't get a waiter job. You talk like a pissed off dishwasher: "Fuck those cunts and their fucking tips." MR. BLONDE So you don't care that they're counting on your tip to live? Mr. White rubs two of his fingers together. MR. WHITE Do you know what this is? It's the world's smallest violin, playing just for the waitresses. MR. BLONDE You don't have any idea what you're talking about. These people bust their ass. This is a hard job. MR. WHITE So's working at McDonald's, but you don't feel the need to tip them. They're servin ya food, you should tip em. But no, society says tip these guys over here, but not those guys over there. That's bullshit. MR. ORANGE They work harder than the kids at McDonald's. MR. WHITE Oh yeah, I don't see them cleaning fryers. MR. BROWN These people are taxed on the tips they make. When you stiff 'em, you cost them money. MR. BLONDE Waitressing is the number one occupation for female non-college graduates in this country. It's the one jab basically any woman can get, and make a living on. The reason is because of tips. MR. WHITE Fuck all that. They all laugh. MR. WHITE Hey, I'm very sorry that the government taxes their tips. That's fucked up. But that ain't my fault. it would appear that waitresses are just one of the many groups the government fucks in the ass on a regular basis. You show me a paper says the government shouldn't do that, I'll sign it. Put it to a vote, I'll vote for it. But what I won't do is play ball. And this non- college bullshit you're telling me, I got two words for that: "Learn to fuckin type." Cause if you're expecting me to help out with the rent, you're in for a big fuckin surprise. MR. ORANGE He's convinced me. Give me my dollar back. Everybody laughs. Joe's comes back to the table. JOE Okay ramblers, let's get to rambling. Wait a minute, who didn't throw in? MR. ORANGE Mr. White. JOE (to Mr. Orange) Mr. White? (to Mr. White) Why? MR. ORANGE He don't tip. JOE (to Mr. Orange) He don't tip? (to Mr. White) You don't tip? Why? MR. ORANGE He don't believe in it. JOE (to Mr. Orange) He don't believe in it? (to Mr. White) You don't believe in it? MR. ORANGE Nope. JOE (to Mr. Orange) Shut up! (to Mr. White) Cough up the buck, ya cheap bastard, I paid for your goddamn breakfast. MR. WHITE Because you paid for the breakfast, I'm gonna tip. Normally I wouldn't. JOE Whatever. Just throw in your dollar, and let's move. (to Mr. Blonde) See what I'm dealing with here. Infants. I'm fuckin dealin with infants. The eight men get up to leave. Mr. White's waist is in the F.G. As he buttons his coat, for a second we see he's carrying a gun. They exit Uncle Bob's Pancake House, talking amongst themselves.


Member: David H
Location: Nashville TN
Date: 6/22/2003
Time: 9:04:02 PM

Comments

Spiriality and relaspe. Besides following the other good suggestions I have heard here, I hit my knees every morning and ask GOD for the gift of sobriety. Sinse I have been doing that I have not found it necessary to take a drink for over 4 years. Ive even stopped smoking using the same techniques. I highly reccomend sending the God of your understanding a little knee mail every morning. I works for this alcoholic.


Member: Hankster
Location: Kalispell, Montana
Date: 6/22/2003
Time: 10:16:53 PM

Comments

Interesting and hard hitting topic, Kelly. Although it sounds harsh, you are correct in your assessment that one who doesn't practice COMPLETE sobriety is acting in a stupid fashion. One is either 'clean and sober' or one is not. Just like pregnancy, there is no in between. In my years attending A.A., I have seen hundreds of people practicing 'psuedo sobriety' and it never works. I've seen members on 'beer maintenance,' 'mariujuana maintenance,' pills, and nicotine. If you use ANY type of mood altering or addictive substance, you are not clean and sober. No beer, no wine, no pills, no cigarettes, no cocaine, no marijuana, nothing. We have all gotten into trouble by fooling ourselves into thinking "this is all right" or "I can handle this." But, the truth is that all drugs, both the legal and the illegal types, lead to the same result. It sounds easier than it is in practice, but just remember 'clean and sober' means just that. Do not put any mood altering or addictive substances into your body, not even a little portion and not even because the substance is legal. Don't take a sip of beer, don't take a puff of a cigarette, don't take a pill because you feel off. May God be with you. In the end, it is God and only God that will give you the gift of complete sobriety. Peace be with you.


Member:
Location:
Date: 6/22/2003
Time: 10:56:45 PM

Comments

To the woman whjo started the topic, what is the topic and what was all that mumbo jumbo??


Member: Alcoholic
Location: Anonymous
Date: 6/23/2003
Time: 12:26:02 AM

Comments

Hankster, You got to be kidding me... no cig`s come on ? If we didnt smoke then the newcomers would not be able to learn about service work now would they. Come on i took a shower today & i have not had a drink today i`m clean & sober right? Please dont try to cure all my problems at once i would not be able to handle it & i would be sure to drink then. Be carefull my friend, it sounds like your going to burn out with that attitude. I have seen it happen to a few of us. Remember AA is not a cure-all.


Member: dee
Location: NY
Date: 6/23/2003
Time: 2:22:21 AM

Comments

I do not know how to get to the point of giving alcohol up. PLEASE HELP!!!!!!!!!!


Member: Mike H
Location: Jackson MI
Date: 6/23/2003
Time: 4:15:00 AM

Comments

Mike, alcoholic. I have been battling alcohol for 30yrs. Up until now I have had what I call the "revolving door syndrome". I would get sick, sober up for awhile, then go back and try it again. For some reason, as long as I worked the steps and prayed, I didn't drink. When I felt well I stopped working the steps and forgot about praying. Needless to say I got drunk. At this point in my life I have quit fighting alcohol and have surrendered to the program. I have 41 days sober. I have had ups and downs but have not taken that first drink. I have only me and my stubborn will to blame for picking up that first drink that starts it off. Success can only come from hard work on myself. It took a long time to learn this.


Member: AMG
Location: WASHINGTON
Date: 6/23/2003
Time: 4:51:57 AM

Comments

hello everyone in order not to drink you have to be ready and committed to the steps and tradtions, go to meetings, pray and stop hanging around the people and places that got you started in the first place. everyone falls but when you do get back into aa. dont give up just because of that fall. it will and can happen to the best of us. good luck, and hang in there. thanks


Member: Julia Anne
Location: Midland, MI
Date: 6/23/2003
Time: 7:45:54 AM

Comments

Good morning all. Dee, my prayers are with you. Quitting an addiction is a difficult thing. You just have to decide that you want to quit. No one can do that for you. You must look deep inside yourself and gather the strength to make a total commitment to stop. In doing this, you should ask God for the strength to overcome your addiction. If you ask with all your heart and truly want to quit, He will give you the strength. And once you have made that decision, make it your goal each and every day to stay completely clean and sober for that day. That means you don't taper off, you quit - completely. You don't cut down to two beers a day or anything else. As mentioned above, it's all or nothing. Also, David H and Hankster make good points. You have to quit all drugs, including pills, tobacco, cocaine - all drugs. If you don't, you are just fooling yourself into thinking that it's all right to continue using one drug as long as you don't drink. The next thing you know, you've deluded yourself into thinking it's all right to use another drug. And then you fool yourself into thinking it's all right to drink a little. And the whole process starts over again. Just stay completely clean and sober one day at a time. Don't worry about tomorrow. Just worry about today. May God bless you and keep you. Put all your faith in our Heavenly Father and He will see you through anything.


Member: Disscuss
Location: This
Date: 6/23/2003
Time: 9:31:40 AM

Comments

Narrow-minded religious bigots Mike S. Adams (archive) June 23, 2003 | Print | Send MAs I was browsing around my university's website last Fall, I noticed an extensive list of recommended readings in a section labeled "spirituality" on the project B-Glad portion of the website. Project B-Glad is a taxpayer-funded educational project focusing on gay, lesbian, bisexual, and trans-gendered persons issues which is sponsored by the Office of Campus Diversity. Our chancellor signed the project into effect on September 11, 2001. Perhaps I should commend our administration for remaining productive on a day when most Americans were mourning the loss of thousands in the terrorist attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon. However, I am bothered by the fact that all of the religious readings which have been posted as part of the project have been pro-homosexual. (e.g., Faith and Religion in the Lives of Gay Men; Lesbian, Gay, and Bisexual People within Organized Religion; and about 14 other books). Because I wanted to see the university add some readings which reflect a different perspective, I wrote to our chancellor with a few suggestions. First, I advised him to insert a disclaimer at the top of the Project B-Glad "spirituality" section which says, "UNCW does not take a position on the question of whether homosexuality is compatible with the Bible." After that, I asked him to add eight religiously-based recommend readings which discuss the possible negative effects of homosexuality on various social institutions. (e.g., Utopia Against the Family; Coming Out of Homosexuality; and Homosexuality and the Politics of Truth). Despite sending my requests by both regular mail and e-mail, I never heard back from the chancellor. As of this writing, the Office of Campus Diversity continues to post only pro-homosexual religious readings on its website. They also reinforce the idea of compatibility between homosexuality and religion with various highly paid campus speakers. For example, Mel White has been hired to assert compatibility between Christianity and homosexuality. Irshad Manji, a self-described "queer Muslim," has spoken on the compatibility between homosexuality and Islam. To my knowledge, no religious speaker has ever been paid to proffer a contrary view. Additionally, since 1999 I have heard complaints from students who have applied to be student orientation leaders at UNCW. Specifically, several have reported that they were quizzed about their attitudes towards homosexuality during the application process. The students who spoke to me had religious objections to homosexuality which they kept to themselves during their interviews for fear of having their applications rejected. Of course, it is difficult to understand how attitudes towards homosexuality affect the ability to lead brief campus tours for prospective students during orientation. More recently, it has come to my attention that students employed in various positions at my university have been subjected to lectures by diversity proponents who specifically assert compatibility between Christianity and homosexuality. In a time of deep budgetary crisis, it is difficult to understand why the university pays for these lectures. Again, they promote only one view on this controversial and highly personal subject. I hope that many who are reading this article have also read my recent article documenting the unconstitutional assault on religious student organizations at UNC-Chapel Hill. Readers of both articles may well conclude that an effort to establish homosexuality as the official state religion is well underway in the UNC system. I also hope that readers will agree with my assertion that the UNC system is in need of a new form of sensitivity training. Towards that end, I will soon be proposing First Amendment sensitivity training sessions for university administrators on all sixteen UNC campuses. One of the main goals of the program will be to allow both individual students and campus religious groups to form their own opinions about the compatibility of homosexuality and religion. College administrators will be asked to tackle other issues like rising tuition costs. I know that my initiative will be well received because UNC administrators care about the First Amendment. In fact, many said so last summer when they decried an attempt by the state legislature to block the use of Approaching the Koran in the summer reading program at UNC Chapel Hill. Many of those self-proclaimed defenders of academic freedom said that we must make sure that the UNC system is not controlled by narrow minded religious bigots. I certainly wouldn't want that to happen. But I'm afraid it already has. Mike S. Adams (adams_mike@hotmail.com) is an associate professor at UNC-Wilmington and a frequent Townhall.com contributor.


Member: Hiwaya
Location:
Date: 6/23/2003
Time: 10:04:25 AM

Comments

How infantile, to post the above on three different rooms on this site, so people have to scroll three different times to get past the irrelevance. Whoever you are, you wasted your time. Dee, call AA and ask for help. There is a solution. We alcoholics are masters of isolation, struggling against the impossible, and killing ourselves all by ourselves. Please ask for help. The only way to get out of the addiction is to stop fighting. People can help you with that. They really can. Believe it or not, in just a few short days or weeks or monthis, life can do a complete turn-around, you just don't have to keep feeling this way. Blessings.


Member: Craig L (Dogmanor@yahoo.com)
Location: Aloha, Oregon
Date: 6/23/2003
Time: 10:19:00 AM

Comments

Craig here, another "real alcoholic" (page 21). If I woke up this morning and found I had no legs, I would have to live every moment around the fact I am legless. If I tried to behave as though I had legs, I would look pretty silly or best pathetic. My alcoholism is the same, if I try to behave as though I am not alcoholic, the results are very sad. I have a progressive, fatal disease of body, mind and spirit. I have a daily reprieve based solely on my spiritual condition.


Member: Jay T
Location: Midwest
Date: 6/23/2003
Time: 10:34:06 AM

Comments

Jay here alcoholic/addict. Does anyone here know of a good AA online meeting? This one is rapidly losing it's appeal.


Member: Lori
Location: Florida
Date: 6/23/2003
Time: 10:44:02 AM

Comments

To Dee, Surrender is the key to sobriety. This disease lives and breeds in our brains and will set you up for the next drink. It tells you all the lies your used to hearing, that make the next drink touch your lips. The abnormal has become normal. Change is not a welcomed thing for us alkies. All you have to do is be "WILLING". This program is for people that "WANT" it, not "NEED" it. It works if you want it to. Go to meetings, find a sponsor & pray to God. He will answer your prayers always just not in the manner you want him to.


Member: SUSIE
Location: KENTUCKY
Date: 6/23/2003
Time: 1:19:00 PM

Comments

2Dee Call your A.A. central office in your town It should be listed in telephone. and ask 4 someone 2 talk 2. Wow my 1 time here and already a little scared. Whatever happen 2 love and tolerance. Now that don't mean to me candy coat stuff but some things i heard are hatred not love. Never be a evangelist or reformer. NEVER TALK DOWN FROM A SPIRITUAL HILLTOP.


Member: Josh
Location: CT.
Date: 6/23/2003
Time: 2:32:48 PM

Comments

Hi my name is Josh how AA help me after many drunken days and nights many car wrecks 3 dui's it was time for me to go to treatment 30 days O-NO I didn't think I was going to get out of there they where nuts heard alot of things I didn't like I was to change all my friends change my thinking go to meetings sponser I didn't didn't want to hear any of it so I just sat there yes sir yes sir the hole time I was saying to myself I CAN NOT go threw with this these people are NUTS do I they think I can realy go threw with this so I'm counting the days 28 29 my bags are packed the last night the night before I couldn't sleep I'm counting the hours then the minutes I mean my ass is on FIRE I want out 30 I picked my bag up and down the road I went BUCK-50 never looking back I new I couldn't do AA it just wasn't for me I have nothing against AA THEY DID HELP ME TO SEE THE LIGHT AND I HAVE BEEN VERY VERY LUCKY this was in 1982 and I have been SOBER THANK YOU AA FOR SHOWING ME THE WAY I'm not going to say it was easy but I just couldn't go threw it again I was just sick of being sick the first 5 years were hard I was mad at the world but it did get easyer today I can say I'm a very happy man I'm SOBER thats the way I am they say go left I go right I never can follow the rules AGAIN I HAVE NOTHING AGANST AA I SHOULD SAY I FOLLOW RULE I DON'T DRINK AN THIS IS NOT BS SO PLEASE SAY SOBER YOU'LL LOVE IT AND YOURSELF


Member: Bitsey
Location: CALIF
Date: 6/23/2003
Time: 4:05:33 PM

Comments

Dee-get to a meetng and do it one day at a time. For me right now it is one minute at a time. I am not going to drink for just this minute. Post here if you need to. Say the serenity prayer.


Member: Bitsey
Location: CALIF
Date: 6/23/2003
Time: 4:05:34 PM

Comments

Dee-get to a meetng and do it one day at a time. For me right now it is one minute at a time. I am not going to drink for just this minute. Post here if you need to. Say the serenity prayer.


Member: disgusted
Location: surfin thru
Date: 6/23/2003
Time: 4:15:22 PM

Comments

whathefuck does half these posts have to do with sharing your esperience strength & hope? cant you sorry siciass sobs have alittle common deciency and allow the few folks who are trying to stop drinking get a little help from the real AA's...this site has really gone to hell!


Member:
Location:
Date: 6/23/2003
Time: 5:39:15 PM

Comments

Hey mr. disgusted---so the fuck what you idiot!!!! If yta don't like it, LEAVE asshole!!!! We don't give a damn if you're here or not bastard!!!!!!


Member: Lisa
Location: NYC
Date: 6/23/2003
Time: 5:46:39 PM

Comments

Let's talk about SEX, can we????


Member: SOMEBODY
Location: SOMEWHERE
Date: 6/23/2003
Time: 5:55:12 PM

Comments

LET THE FIRES OF HELL CONSUME IT... IT HAS NO STRUCTURE OR PURPOSE OTHER THAN BABBLING FOOLS... BITCHING ABOUT POINTLESS SUBJECTS.


Member: SOMEBODY
Location: SOMEWHERE
Date: 6/23/2003
Time: 6:04:02 PM

Comments

SEX???... SEE WHAT I MEAN... WE START WITH AA STUFF, AND END UP WITH OTHER STUFF. MAYBE THEY SHOULD CHANGE THE NATURE OF THIS PAGE TO AN ALL TOPIC DISCUSSION GROUP. ANYONE AGREE???


Member: TSOI
Location: KENTUCKY
Date: 6/23/2003
Time: 6:35:15 PM

Comments

THIS IS FOR ALL WHO ARE COMPLAINING. GET A GRIP. A.A. IS ABOUT LEARNING HOW TO TOLERATE EVERYONE. READ YOUR 12 AND 12.!!!!!!!!!!


Member:
Location:
Date: 6/23/2003
Time: 7:05:20 PM

Comments

EVERYBODY DUCK... VIRUS ATTACK COMING


Member:
Location:
Date: 6/23/2003
Time: 7:05:54 PM

Comments

3


Member:
Location:
Date: 6/23/2003
Time: 7:06:07 PM

Comments

2


Member:
Location:
Date: 6/23/2003
Time: 7:06:19 PM

Comments

1


Member:
Location:
Date: 6/23/2003
Time: 7:06:36 PM

Comments

FIRE!!!


Member:
Location:
Date: 6/23/2003
Time: 7:08:05 PM

Comments

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Member: BUGBEAR
Location: HIDDEN
Date: 6/23/2003
Time: 7:19:23 PM

Comments

MR. BUGBEAR AT YOUR SERVICE...HA! HA! HA! ANY MORE BICKERING OR MEANINGLESS POSTING... AND THE NEXT STRIKE WILL BE OVERWHELMING. THEREFORE I SUGGEST THAT PEOPLE STICK TO THE TOPIC PRESENTED... OR SHOULD WE CHANGE THE TOPIC TO VIRUSES...HA! HA! HA!


Member: Unknown
Location: CA
Date: 6/23/2003
Time: 9:12:14 PM

Comments

To the idiots who have nothing better to do than to post ridiculous comments, Please leave because there are people that really have stumbled on this site to get help and to get sober. I am one of many and to even say something on this site is a step forward because even admitting that I have a problem is something that is difficult and almost impossible for someone like myself. I read the posts every chance I have; to learn and understand. Please take your ignorance somewhere else.


Member: Julie
Location: Chicago
Date: 6/23/2003
Time: 10:36:02 PM

Comments

I have a small point to make here. I don't think we should talk about sex unless it is effecting our sobriety. When you're used to drinking to have sex, drinking to want sex, drinking to feel attractive or attracted, well...there is a tie to sex and drinking. It's a slippery spot for me where I used to drink, and one slippery spot I don't want to permanently check off my list of things to do in life. I am trying to find how to navigate it. A bit like going to basketball games, having a good laugh at a comedy club, meeting a friend for dinner ...whatever I have been shown that I can do better sober. It is a tougher spot to mend because we can't really talk about it and can't exactly attend with sober friends as you could do in any of the afore mentioned. It's even tough to turn over. After all we don't need it. We want it. And how embarrassing it that. It's not a joke if it is hard to find a way to do it sober. I find when my program is good and everything is real -- the Coffee smells better, the laughter clearer, and feelings deeper, both good and bad---that sometimes this program, finds a space in me. It can show me a way to replace the memories now occupied by drunken escapades with thier narrow glimpses of excitement, followed by many lost moments of my self. And this is what I need to build on. Working the steps. Keeping it honest. Trusting that in Gods world, it is as it should be---sober.


Member: Little Running Bear
Location: Saginaw, MI
Date: 6/23/2003
Time: 11:38:58 PM

Comments

It is very sad that the comments on this site have deteriorated to such a level as some of the remarks which have been posted today. However, it is no different than what I have seen in meetings throughout my years in A.A. People pepper their comments with profanity, people lie, people steal, people continue to drink and do drugs, etc. It can be quite distressing. But, remember that only a very small percentage of people actually get clean and sober (less than five percent). Look for those who have actual (as opposed to claimed) sobriety, and seek them out. They will be the folks that behave themselves at meetings, are honest, are courteous, etc. They are few and far between, but they are worth seeking out. For the rest of the 'mere attendees' at A.A., just as the people who post the offensive comments here, just ignore them. Use them as an example of how not to live. They are quite sick and we should pray for them, but we should not be dragged down by them. For those of you who are really trying, do not be deterred. Our Heavenly Father is with you and He will not fail you or leave you - ever - if you are true to Him. God Bless You and good night.


Member:
Location:
Date: 6/23/2003
Time: 11:45:05 PM

Comments

Good comment Julie from Chi-town ---appreciate it sweetheart!!


Member: DELIA O
Location: CA
Date: 6/24/2003
Time: 12:31:10 AM

Comments

i really need an online talk. to share what i am feeling as an alcholic/addict. i will check later. have goodness.


Member: Melanie
Location: Akron, Ohio, USA
Date: 6/24/2003
Time: 2:54:55 AM

Comments

Hello, friends! I'm Melanie, an alcoholic. Relapse and spirituality. Relapse is not part of the A.A. program. We do not ALL relapse at some point or other. To acheive and maintain sobriety one must do certain things. First, a hospital stay (when necessary.) Next, don't drink, one day at a time. Get a Big Book and read it immediately. Go to meetings and find someone to help you with the steps. Someone who has worked them and uses them on a daily basis. Listen and ask around, you'll know who to choose soon. Work the steps...ALL TWELVE...REPEATEDLY!!! Continue to go to meetings in order to help others and to maintain your own sobriety. Individual A.A. members can help guide me, but I must do the work and take responsibility for my sobriety. Others may anger or disappoint me, but I must decide to take the drink that begins a relapse. By working the steps and helping others, I learn to cope with life's ups and downs with faith and sobriety. The twelve steps are the path to personal spirituality. My concept of God is based on love, forgiveness, generosity, emotional comfort, knowledge and power. I found this all when I WORKED the twelve steps. Blessings to all, especially to those who suffer.


Member: AnilG
Location: Mt vernon,IL
Date: 6/24/2003
Time: 8:13:39 AM

Comments

I am an alcoholic Hi everyone dont drink go to meetings get a sponser and get the steps into your life! that what i was told when i first came to A.A.i had the desire to stop and i was willing to go to any lengths to stay sober! that was 2nd jan sept 1998 havnt needed a drink since this works if you really want it ! be spiritual and thank god for everything he has done . read your serenity paryer take day at a time.thanks to aa for giving me the tools to work my life.


Member: debbie
Location: ut
Date: 6/24/2003
Time: 10:13:17 AM

Comments

Iam sorry I hope the topic is relapse. I suggest poeple look at there addict voice.It wants to live as much as you do and it wants to be happy as much as you do. In order to please the addict voice you have to use and to not use would thriten the addicts life so it will fight you all the way. So when it starts fighting for its life fight back with hope your happyness you want and your dreams of a better life and your will to win and put the addict to death.And if you use ask yourself is the addict happy now no because it wants to keep using can you ever make it happy no not untill your dead is it worth it the addicts happyness or yours you decide not the addict. Key word you not it believe in you and keep fighting. god bless.


Member: Teresa B.
Location: Indiana
Date: 6/24/2003
Time: 10:43:08 AM

Comments

Hi everybody, Teresa alcoholic. Dee: Glad you mustered up the nerve to post, inspite of the trolls. As has been previously said, find face-to-face meetings to go to, pick one as your home group, that you attend each week. Read the Big Book, get a bunch of phone numbers from people of the same gender (if you are straight,) and call them when you get squirrley (sp?) Everyone: On relapse prevention: I too have a relapse, yet I don't believe everyone has to have one. One danger sign is self-confidence, especially after we've had some time in the program. Pretty easy once the cravings leave to relax and say hey, I'm on easy street now. I don't need the Higher Power like I used to. Or to spend less time on the basics, i.e. working the steps, reading the Big Book, taking time for prayer and mediation, going to meetings, making phone calls. Or deciding that we don't need to change all the character defects, there's one or two that we really like a whole lot. On Trolls:In my experience, the best way to handle online trolls, those sad individuals who post rude-nonsensical-offtopic messages, is to ignore them. They are sick and sad people crying out for attention. When you reply to them, it feeds their sickness and encourages them to post even sicker stuff. Nothing gets rid of trolls better than to be completely ignored. Have a great 24.....


Member: Bob
Location: Uk
Date: 6/24/2003
Time: 11:34:32 AM

Comments

Hi Bob here. I'm an alcoholic. Just who is messing up the site? Please show some respect for those of us who get help here. I'm touched by what you said Dee. I've been there and it ain't no picnic. I was SO close to suicide. My life was shit and all these AA buggers would tell me was to give up alcohol; and that was the only thing that I thought could keep me sane! Eventually it got so bad that I was prepared to go to any lengths. The advice you received from many of the others is so sound. Get sober - (you can get medical help for this if you need it) - call the helpline and ask for help. Meetings are full of people just like you. There are people in the rooms that can and will help. Some things seem crazy at first - but if you're ready they will work. If you can't trust that God will get you out of the Hell of alcoholism try trusting AA. I believe That God helps me ..now I do.. I didn't at first. When I finally acknowledged that I am powerless and that He is in control things got better. My higher power hasn't promised me heaven but He sure does his best to keep me out of Hell. The rest seems to be up to me. That's eight months now and my life is great. I can't really believe it sometimes. Thanks to the Fellowship I've got a life which is worth living.


Member: Kim D.
Location: Bridgewater
Date: 6/24/2003
Time: 12:00:06 PM

Comments

((Little Running Bear)) Well said - thank you. I was about to let the trolls steal some of my serenity and happiness with this site, but after reading you I don't need to. Stick with the winners and not everyone in the Halls are here to get well - some stay sick. Thanks ~*~*~ If the topic is relapse - been there done that. I bounced in and out of AA from the age of 17 to the age of 31. Why? Because I couldn't surrender to my alcoholism - I couldn't take suggestions and do the Steps as they are layed out in the Big Book - and I hadn't had enough pain, although many, many times I could have sworn I did. Today, I have homegroup and a job in that group. I have a sponsor. I'm working the steps. I go on commitments when I can. I have daily contact with a recovery alcoholic. Today, I'm teachable.


Member: A Must
Location: Read
Date: 6/24/2003
Time: 2:21:25 PM

Comments

No arrogance like liberal arrogance Dennis Prager (archive) June 24, 2003 | Print | Send The first same-sex marriage in North American history has just taken place. The highest court of Ontario has ruled that the millennia-old definition of marriage of one man and one woman violates Canada's constitution. How did three people change marriage, always understood to be a privilege defined by society, into a right defined by judges? How can three people have the hubris to overturn a pillar of Western civilization without allowing their society to have a say in the matter? There is a one-word answer to these questions. Liberalism. There is no arrogance like liberal arrogance. Nowhere in the conservative world is there anything to match it. Liberals are certain that they know more, understand more, are more tolerant and more compassionate than anyone else. Therefore, there is no inclination for a liberal judge to allow democracy to determine society's values. The idea that the public should be allowed to vote on one of the most significant issues in the life of a society offends them: Did Moses have the Israelites vote on murder or adultery? Why then would a liberal judge have Americans or Canadians vote on abortion or the definition of marriage? The liberal American justices who created a constitutional right to kill a human fetus for any reason could not care less what the American people believed about the worth of the human fetus. If nine out of every 10 Americans thought that a woman and her doctor needed a moral reason to extinguish nascent human life, it would only have reinforced the liberal justices' beliefs that America needs their enlightened minds to counteract such foolishness. So, too, the Canadian justices are quite unconcerned with Canadians' opinions or values. The justices believe that the definition of marriage needs to change, so they changed it. It's as simple as that. They know better because they are liberals. But liberal hubris runs even deeper than that. When conservatives are sure of their positions, it is almost always because they believe that a pre-existing and higher source of morality demands that position. To take our present example, conservative opposition to redefining marriage comes from respect for millennia-old values -- those of Western society and those of the Judeo-Christian tradition. Conservatives, of course, may be wrong, but their position is not rooted in belief in self, but belief in a text that they hold far higher than their own opinions and feelings. Not so liberals. There is no biblical or Western basis for redefining marriage. There is only the individual liberal's high self-esteem: He is so compassionate, so enlightened and so decent that his opinion must surely prevail. The conservative, on the other hand, asks what the founders of his society really meant, what the Bible says, and, yes, what does the citizenry want. Liberals don't ask such questions. They find the question of what the founders' views were to be irrelevant or even contemptible (the founders, after all, are frequently viewed as economics-driven, white, male slave holders); they rarely care what the Bible says, since they regard it as neither divine nor morally compelling; and they have contempt for the citizenry, as it contains a large number of fools (i.e., non-liberals) to be feared for their lack of enlightenment and education. What liberals ask is how they themselves feel, not what a text or a founder or a religion teaches. This is one reason liberalism is so attractive. One need not know, let alone wrestle with, prior texts or values. One need only consult one's feelings to know what is right (hence the liberal preoccupation with the word compassion). Indeed, to the extent prior texts are studied, they are done so not to learn from but to deconstruct, i.e., to delegitimize. Therefore, with no prior religious or national value system to restrain them, liberals are free to invent morality in the image of their hearts. That is how three people can effortlessly redefine marriage. They felt like it.


Member: Carlc
Location: nm
Date: 6/24/2003
Time: 3:33:23 PM

Comments

People wonder why the post is all jacked up, small wonder, Did anyone figure out what the topic was? I agree with whoever posted about mumbo jumbo, people talk about the most insane things and get mad when someone goes along with the nonsense. This is serious serious business, life and death in fact and we are talking about bullshit, the people who post all crazy dont bother me as much as the people who are actually trying to give advice and dont know what the hell they are talking about, all this frothy, pretty, nonsense could actually get some poor alcoholic dead. The wrong doings of others fancied or real have the actual power to kill. If people want to stop drinking that is between them and their higher power, but our job in AA is to be of service to them, not bullshit them.


Member: Bern C
Location: Bothell, WA.
Date: 6/24/2003
Time: 3:59:22 PM

Comments

One of the things my sponsor said was that when he came in to AA they told him try not to drink right now. Just don't drink right now. After a while he figured out that it was Always going to be right now. I discovered it is about choice. Way back when, I made a choice to drink. Shortly after, I made a choice to try pot. This was followed by a choice to take crosstops. I'm sure you all get the idea. At some point, I lost that power of choice. I thought I was "Partying," or, "Having a good time" when in fact all I was doing was resigning my power of choice. My life became a pursuit of release. I wanted to be someone else, doing something else, feeling some other way then how I felt. One day, I chose to come to AA (trust me, I was a mess. It was Not an easy decision) and ask for help. As a result of that decision, I have had the power of choice, as it pertains to drugs and alcohol, returned. Today, I live sober because I have come to love who I am, where I am, and (mostly) how I feel. If you think you have a problem with alcohol, then you do. Once the problem has been defined, a solution can be looked for. AA has a solution that has worked for many. It has worked for me. If the solution makes sense, then a plan of action is what is needed. Simply put, the problem is loss of choice regarding alcohol, the solution is self searching, leveling of pride, and confession of shortcomings. The plan of action is the twelve steps as outlined the book Alcoholics Anonymous. See, I could stop drinking. I did it Plenty of times. I just could not Stay stopped. Life without release was intolerable. The program of AA and members of the fellowship have given, and I mean Given, handed over, dropped in my lap, the very tools I lacked to make life without alcohol bearable. And I have found, much to my surprise, that life today is not just bearable but wonderful, and I do mean full of wonder. Gads, I do prattle on. Hankster, do you include coffee in your drug free outlook. I ask because you did not mention it. Me, I can't drink the stuff because I am a speed freak. I do, however, consider those who still use coffee or cigarettes (which I also quit) sober. It is semantics. How does one define sober? Before AA, sober meant sane and rational thinking (Something I merely glanced at during active addiction but actually visit these days). After AA it has come to mean freedom from alcohol (us druggies like to add all that fun stuff, like coke, speed, pot, etc. to that short but important list). Coffee and cigarettes? Addictive? Sure. Are you sober if you use them? I am of the opinion that that decision is up to the person. I will say this; the meeting I go to would be pretty damn small if all the smokers and coffee drinkers stopped showing up. The only way to quit drinking is to quit drinking. "Don't Feed the Trolls"


Member: ultan c
Location: ireland
Date: 6/24/2003
Time: 4:09:33 PM

Comments

first time 2 visit , sorta reminds me of ftf mtgs ,some people i find interesting others i dont ,hope ur trying 2 get better a day at a time


Member: Bitsey
Location: CA
Date: 6/24/2003
Time: 4:19:25 PM

Comments

To Jay T-you could start an on-line meeting at Yahoo on the chat lines under New User Group. Maybe I will do that myself- I have not seen a meeting on there yet. Hmmm interesting posting here-If I don't like something I just leave..........Sober 8 days -don't know how many times around. I had 2 years and went back out. I can't even remember why or when. Just put the drink in my hand & BAM! 2 years of sobriety gone & another 2 years pass in a fog! Then you have the guilt & the shame & then another drink to rid myself of the quilt & shame. & my children grow up while I am not watching except through the fog. Anyway , I hope I am finished.....I am for this minute-I am for Today-which is a big key for me. i don't have to give up german beer and red wine forever-just for this minute. I just don't drink today one day at a time. Thats how I got sober last time and it it has worked for the past 7.5 days. I hope whoever put that long "viris" will stop. I have a short period of time to be on here and that just wasted a whole bunch of it. Dee if your out there check in-we are all caring about you. I am so glad this site is here.


Member: Julie
Location: Chicago
Date: 6/24/2003
Time: 8:42:50 PM

Comments

Delia, Check back for someone to talk with. Your comment, "have goodness" tugged my heart. I know I felt so low, it was hard to hold that thought for long. You do have goodness. You also have a disease. You're responsible for working on getting better. I could try to talk with you. It would be best to get to a meeting and find someone who you can relate too. It can mean the world of difference to have someone to call, someone who knows you. Being there for each other is what is all about. Over the internet, sometimes we don't have the "person" on the line when we need then. It still doesn't work like a talk, a phone call, a hug. Check back. I'll be praying for you! Julie


Member: KEITH L.
Location: SAN DI EGO!
Date: 6/24/2003
Time: 8:58:57 PM

Comments

We admitted we were poweless over alcohol & our lives were unmanageable.The First Step. I had no problem being powerless over alcohol.I DID have a problem with admitting my life is unmanageable.I AM SPECIAL after all!!! You guys smiled and told me to keep coming back.And just to spite you,I did!!Thru the Grace of God & the Fellowship of AA I have not found it necessary to take a drink sine Dec 8 1987. To newcomers suggest going to 90 meetings in 90 days (more if you can) G et a copy of the Big Book.As a tip if you cannot sleep read The Big Book when you go to bed!!Find a sponsor.There is a really good pamphlet available in most meetings called,"questions & answers on sponsorship." Oh,& by the way don't drink or do any drugs(including THC)on a minute by minute,second by second basis.This way you get to stay alive,plus your life will get better!!!


Member: just in time
Location: here
Date: 6/24/2003
Time: 10:46:46 PM

Comments

carlc go outside for awile! do you live on this site?


Member: Carlc
Location: nm
Date: 6/24/2003
Time: 11:07:56 PM

Comments

Little Running Bear, Thank You, Thank You, Thank You. 3 out of 100 alcoholics will die sober the rest die drunk. I would think people would take this a little more serious.


Member: SUSIE
Location: KENTUCKY
Date: 6/25/2003
Time: 12:06:12 AM

Comments

I READ THIS STUFF ON HERE AND I AM SAD ABOUT IT. THIS IS A LIFE OR DEATH DISEASE THAT KILLS. NEVER GIVE UP HOPE. A.A. DOESN'T CHANGE THE PEOPLE DO. IN THE BEGINNING THEY WORKED WITH LOW-BOTTOM ALCOHOLICS. WHY BECAUSE THEY WERE READY 2 DO ANYTHING THAT WOULD LIFT THE UNFORGIVING OBESSION OF ALCOHOLISM. WHAT ABOUT ANY LENGHTH DO U NOT UNDERSTAND? THAT'S WHAT THEY TOLD ME OVER AND OVER. THANK GOD FOR THE OLDTIMERS HONESTY. THEY SAID WE ARE NOT HERE 2 SAVE YOUR SOUL WE ARE TO SAVE YOUR BUTT. MAY THE GREAT SPIRIT BE WITH YOU.


Member:
Location:
Date: 6/25/2003
Time: 12:25:25 AM

Comments

Get a grip susieq and carlyc old boy, who gives a damn if you want to talk about life and death issues, we alreday know that ya idiots. It doesn't mean we have to focus on that 24 hours a day so quit takin everything (including sl=elves) so seriously. Geeeeeez---chill out or ya might as well have a drink because that's where your headed........


Member:
Location:
Date: 6/25/2003
Time: 12:25:42 AM

Comments

Get a grip susieq and carlyc old boy, who gives a damn if you want to talk about life and death issues, we alreday know that ya idiots. It doesn't mean we have to focus on that 24 hours a day so quit takin everything (including sl=elves) so seriously. Geeeeeez---chill out or ya might as well have a drink because that's where your headed........


Member: BIG DICK
Location:
Date: 6/25/2003
Time: 1:34:12 AM

Comments

LISA, OPEN YOUR LEGS, INSERT FINGER OR FINGERS, AND HAVE YOUR FUCKING SEX.


Member: Mindy B
Location: Tennessee
Date: 6/25/2003
Time: 4:32:51 AM

Comments

This is the first time that I have visited this site. One day at a time, sometimes an hour or whatever it takes to stay sober is my concern. Staying sober is my MAIN focus. I hope that when I visit this room again I will stay in my chair and read some things about staying sober instead of a bunch of letters and numbers taking up space for those of us wanting to stay sober. What do you get out of typing all that jibberous (905=;/n-90#$*&()) EXAMPLE< ? Thank you to the people that are helping me stay sober.


Member: Ron
Location:
Date: 6/25/2003
Time: 6:13:17 AM

Comments

My name is Ron and Im an alcoholic. The most successful 12 step call Ive ever been on was when two guys came to visit me. After asking me if I could go without a drink till Sunday night when the next meeting was been held, I said sure, this was on Tuesday morning. God was my throat parched by Sunday night and was I ever happy to hear them say I could have a drink of water when we got to the meeting. Some one told me " no sex for a year," I guess that would be all right cause I had been released for prison on the Monday six days early after doing eleven years solid and had no sex in all that time. Never did figure out how that helped me stay sober. They told me to do the steps and the next day I enrolled at Arthur Murrys dance studio. I read the big book or at least the biggest one I could find PHARMACEUTIC Information I still have it but I don't have to read it as they gave me another big book which isen't big in size at all. They told me to find a GOD as I understand him Then seek and do GODS will I found that the closest I'll ever come to GOd is in (seeking) him. I finished my dance lessons. Oh yeah some one said to do 90 meetings in 90 days.... In our town we have one meeting a week, the next town is 66 miles down the road south and they have one meeting a week only its on Sunday the same as ours. The next town is 148 miles away and the have 3 meetings a week, To get to a meeting every day I would have to travel 506 miles one way four out of the seven days. But in spite of that advise I was able to stay sober and I always tell the new commer to do it the A.A. way.... one day at a time. and forget about the stupid Treatment Center stuff Wish everyone a good 24 hours


Member: Kathleen
Location: Florida
Date: 6/25/2003
Time: 8:36:58 AM

Comments

Morning ((everyone)) Kathleen, alcoholic. I agree with whoever said about getting rid of the trolls, the only way is to ignore them all together..very true...if you don't feed fire to the fuel it won't grow.. I see a few topics here today. I can just say that I'm very grateful for my sponser who taught me to share only my expierence, strenth and hope with others and not to preach and tell folks what they need to do and not do. I can only share what it was like for me, what happened, and what it is like now. And if that helps someone great. What it was like, I ended up on skid row, liver swollen, seizures from withdrawl. What happened was I got desperate, alcohol quit working for me, couldn't get drunk and couldn't get sober, not a pretty place to be. What it is like today is pretty darn good. I have a home, family and job that I like. Life isn't always easy, and I deal with some physical stuff and lots of doctors and the such. But I'm at peace with myself, no longer full of self hatred and remorse and self pity, and I'm "reasonably happy."...which is wonderful. Once heard a man speak and he said something that made sense to me. He said, "Don't put all your faith and trust in the people of the program cause we are all sick people trying to get well, put all your faith and trust in the program of AA, the 12 steps."... I like the slogans too, that are posted in most AA rooms around the USA. The one I like most I think is "Live and Let Live."... I choose today to keep my serenity, because if I read all the negative posts and get into a debate with them and tell people how I think they should be doing things then I'm not accepting others for the way they are. Who am I to tell someone how to live. I would like to say though that we in AA ought to be careful when advising others on medications. We are not doctors and some folks need prescription medications. Some have died from self righteous AAers telling their "sponsees"...to quit taking all meds. That is not only ludicrious, but dangerous. You may just kill someone with all your self righteous BS...so keep coming back, perhaps one day you really will be Honest, openminded and willing.... Peace Kathleen


Member: Discuss This
Location: Can't antone else see the connection to AA
Date: 6/25/2003
Time: 10:58:01 AM

Comments

No arrogance like liberal arrogance Dennis Prager (archive) June 24, 2003 | Print | Send The first same-sex marriage in North American history has just taken place. The highest court of Ontario has ruled that the millennia-old definition of marriage of one man and one woman violates Canada's constitution. How did three people change marriage, always understood to be a privilege defined by society, into a right defined by judges? How can three people have the hubris to overturn a pillar of Western civilization without allowing their society to have a say in the matter? There is a one-word answer to these questions. Liberalism. There is no arrogance like liberal arrogance. Nowhere in the conservative world is there anything to match it. Liberals are certain that they know more, understand more, are more tolerant and more compassionate than anyone else. Therefore, there is no inclination for a liberal judge to allow democracy to determine society's values. The idea that the public should be allowed to vote on one of the most significant issues in the life of a society offends them: Did Moses have the Israelites vote on murder or adultery? Why then would a liberal judge have Americans or Canadians vote on abortion or the definition of marriage? The liberal American justices who created a constitutional right to kill a human fetus for any reason could not care less what the American people believed about the worth of the human fetus. If nine out of every 10 Americans thought that a woman and her doctor needed a moral reason to extinguish nascent human life, it would only have reinforced the liberal justices' beliefs that America needs their enlightened minds to counteract such foolishness. So, too, the Canadian justices are quite unconcerned with Canadians' opinions or values. The justices believe that the definition of marriage needs to change, so they changed it. It's as simple as that. They know better because they are liberals. But liberal hubris runs even deeper than that. When conservatives are sure of their positions, it is almost always because they believe that a pre-existing and higher source of morality demands that position. To take our present example, conservative opposition to redefining marriage comes from respect for millennia-old values -- those of Western society and those of the Judeo-Christian tradition. Conservatives, of course, may be wrong, but their position is not rooted in belief in self, but belief in a text that they hold far higher than their own opinions and feelings. Not so liberals. There is no biblical or Western basis for redefining marriage. There is only the individual liberal's high self-esteem: He is so compassionate, so enlightened and so decent that his opinion must surely prevail. The conservative, on the other hand, asks what the founders of his society really meant, what the Bible says, and, yes, what does the citizenry want. Liberals don't ask such questions. They find the question of what the founders' views were to be irrelevant or even contemptible (the founders, after all, are frequently viewed as economics-driven, white, male slave holders); they rarely care what the Bible says, since they regard it as neither divine nor morally compelling; and they have contempt for the citizenry, as it contains a large number of fools (i.e., non-liberals) to be feared for their lack of enlightenment and education. What liberals ask is how they themselves feel, not what a text or a founder or a religion teaches. This is one reason liberalism is so attractive. One need not know, let alone wrestle with, prior texts or values. One need only consult one's feelings to know what is right (hence the liberal preoccupation with the word compassion). Indeed, to the extent prior texts are studied, they are done so not to learn from but to deconstruct, i.e., to delegitimize. Therefore, with no prior religious or national value system to restrain them, liberals are free to invent morality in the image of their hearts. That is how three people can effortlessly redefine marriage. They felt like it


Member: KEITH L.
Location: SAN DI EGO! CA
Date: 6/25/2003
Time: 12:04:09 PM

Comments

God=Good Orderly Direction=God Step=Solution To Every Problem=Step Nuts,Going Crazy,=Not Using The Steps=Nuts! Help=His Ever Loving Presence=Help


Member: Kelley S.
Location: Texas
Date: 6/25/2003
Time: 12:14:08 PM

Comments

kelley here alcoholic/addict. I have been using this site a few weeks now, and it seems to help me inbetween real meetings. There are some days, not alot anymore, that I want to go out get high and say fuck the world and everybody in it. But when I get that way I pick up the phone, and it always seems it weighs 200 lbs. But I do it anyway. I refuse to go back to the old way of thinking. It will only take you back into the depths of hell and beyond. AA saved my life, and I will always be greatful for it and all the people in it. God bless all the alcoholics and addicts in this program. It works if you work it. But you HAVE to work it, you can't just skim through it. Go to meetings, get a sponsor, pray, read the big book. And if you feel the need to get fucked up, for God's sake pick up the phone and call somebody who gives a dam, somebody sober. Keep trying, you will eventually get it, it took me 25 years to get clean and sober, but I did FINALLY on 04/04/01. Clean, sober and VERY greatful ever since. To all the assholes who can't respect us or this site, go buy a bottle and fuck yourself with it, to all the rest, God bless and keep coming back.


Member: Mark H
Location: CA
Date: 6/25/2003
Time: 2:04:40 PM

Comments

To the person who posted "Discuss This.. etc". If there is any relevance to AA in your posting, it is much to vague. Try simplifying what your trying to say in less words... rather than continuing to post the same (article's) from some other source over and over again. Explain how this relates to AA in your own words... understand my drift here?


Member: Susan A.
Location: Vernon, Connecticut
Date: 6/25/2003
Time: 2:36:06 PM

Comments

Hi All, I'm Susan and I'm an Alcoholic. I like the 'trolls' analogy. Thanks. A suggestion...for those who would like a clearer or more straight forward topic, get here early Mon morn, and start the meeting. I think the topic is 'relapses'. I was taught to talk about the solution, not the problem, so...I haven't had to drink again, though I've been pretty screwed-up in my thinking at times, because I keep being willing to work the steps once I realize (or it is pointed out to me) that I'm not doing the things that got me sober. I drank because I liked the effect (whether you say 'it fixed everything', 'it filled the black hole in my guts', 'it made me not care', whatever). Reality is, I didn't want to stop, and wouldn't have except when it got real bad the last time, I said an honest prayer for help, and God (who I didn't believe in at the time) gave me the willingness to have an open mind and be honest about the fact drinking was killing me and everthing in my live. If I hadn't found something else to give me the same effects as the drinking, I'd still be drinking (or dead or with a wet brain, wearing a diaper in some asylum, or in jail). That 'something else' is the peace, happiness, & freedom that comes from BELIEVING I can't do it by myself, and don't need to anymore, then turning to God for the -power- to not drink, and working at learning to live sober. Attempting to pass on what I was so freely given keeps me very grateful for this gift of sobriety. The -program of action- of AA has allowed me to have a personality change/spiritual awakening great enough so that I haven't had to drink again. The -fellowship- (meetings, friends, etc) of AA gives me support while I -act- on the program of action (the 12 steps). The support is important...the action is essential. I believe people 'relapse' (not a word I would choose) because they are not taking actions to keep themselves sober. No one ever sat on me, forced a drink into my mouth, and held my nose until I had to drink. I drank because I wanted to drink more than I wanted to be sober. Today, I'm sober because I want to do the work more than I want to drink. Simple program. Not simple to do sometimes. Thanks, all, see you next week...


Member: Mark H
Location: CA
Date: 6/25/2003
Time: 2:42:01 PM

Comments

To all whom encountered the impact of the nasty virus earlier in this post, relax as I know the person who did it, and it isn't likely to happen again. The person was quite stressed out that day, and rather than picking up a drink to ease their irritation... chose another way to vent their frusterations temporarily.


Member: Bitsey
Location: CA
Date: 6/25/2003
Time: 3:40:05 PM

Comments

Bitsey here & I am an alchohalic. OK I said it. First time in all nine days. Experience strength and hope. Thank you kathleen for that reminder and your post. Yes the last 2 years was far worse than before I had 2 years of sobriety. What alot of lost days. AA gaarrentees to spoil your drinking or your misery refunded. Mine certainly was. Sad sad sad. But I am sober today and my hope is I will be sober a minute, an hour and 24 hours from now. Still having a hard time. What an obsession. Well that makes sense to post instead of drink. That is a different perspective altogether.


Member: SJD
Location: NW
Date: 6/25/2003
Time: 4:38:08 PM

Comments

Hello everyone, with the topic being relapse I feel that it is essential to avoid the areas of your life that post the most potential for a relapse. In recovery you must be aware of who you are, and your strenghts and weaknesses. You need to avoid the areas in your life that cause you to stumble, and focus on the areas that aid you in recovery.


Member: Trollin
Location: The Site
Date: 6/25/2003
Time: 5:15:13 PM

Comments

Marky H ole boy from Caly, would that be your way of fessing up dear friend? It's o.k. brother, give yourself a break and don't take yourself or anything else so seriously "all" the time. That being said, why would ya then get after the troll who posted a most excellent analogy of AA culture after your own tirade? Not very nice young man, naughty, naughty you!!!


Member: Ronda
Location: Indiana
Date: 6/25/2003
Time: 5:37:01 PM

Comments

Hi, Ronda--alcoholic. I've been a regular in the program for 1 year, 7 months. In that time I have relapsed twice. The first time after seven months (during my birthdaay) and the second time nearly a year sober(and what do you know, during my birthday). At each relapse, I went on a binge for a few days, sobered up and resumed my regular meeting schedule. I've had two sponsors (the first went to jail, the second one went back out) and I will now be looking for my third. Despite my relapses, I haven't given up. My life for the last year and a half has been 500% plus improved. I have a long way to go, but some day I will get a year chip. I just wish I knew what I keep doing wrong. I read, go to meetings, got a sponsor, volunteer. This birthday thing just seems to be a big trigger--also because it falls so close to father's day (I lost mine due to this disease 2 years ago). Anyway, I survived my first relapse. I have hope and plan to survive this one.


Member: Mark H
Location: CA
Date: 6/25/2003
Time: 6:05:13 PM

Comments

Trollin, I give up (hands in the air)... don't shoot...LOL. I was not having a good day the day I commited my ghastly crime...LOL. Limited and disturbing sleep sometimes brings out the beast in me, and GERD has a wonderful way of interupting ones sleep (antacid generally is useless in my case). Anyway I apologize for my error, but unfortunately the damage is done... and the embedded "viral" impression can't be erased now. In case anyone might be wondering, no I didn't type all that gibberish... I'm not that crazy. It simply was a quick copy and paste into this post box here on this site, from a real virus which somehow found our email inbox. Concerning the other "troll", I'm still not sure how their posting regarding "Liberalism, etc" reflected AA culture, especially since AA isn't even mentional in the post at all. If you understand something I'm missing here, please explain.


Member: Stuart F
Location: London UK
Date: 6/25/2003
Time: 7:52:07 PM

Comments

trust god, clean house, help others....no human power could have relieved our alcoholism. Dr Bob's advice to anyone who was still wondering whether or not they were powerless over alcohol?...keep drinking!! and when you've had enough....pray. meetings won't keep me sober...the only thing that will keep me sober day at a time is God, found and contacted, relied upon and trusted to help kme live in peace, and have a life beyond my wildest dreams. AA presumes sobriety....the objective of AA is a spiritual awakening.....most of us who have been around AA for a while know we cannot have that on a bellyful of booze God Bless you all


Member: DP
Location: Canada
Date: 6/25/2003
Time: 7:53:24 PM

Comments

Name: DP Location: Canada Date: 6/25/2003 Time: 4:27:17 PM Comments: My best friend in the world has been sober for 2+ years...lately has not been going to meetings, thinking he is being a hypocrite because he smokes marijauna...I say it is AA not NA and I would far sooner he smoke a bit than take that drink..I am terrified that he is on his way to a major slip...any opinions?


Member: Stuart F
Location: london uk
Date: 6/25/2003
Time: 8:06:17 PM

Comments

DP I've got tons of opinions, buit you don't need them...here's my experience...let go with love. You can only carry the message, not the alcoholic. Be there for him. Seems as if he hasn't found his rock bottom yet and believes he has power. If he's a reall alkie, as you know, he ain't got the power...he has to find out his powerlessness...this hurts you I know...Pray for him, I will pray with you and take care of your own sobriety


Member: mad head and piss head
Location: in key skills lecture at college
Date: 6/26/2003
Time: 5:44:28 AM

Comments

im not being like stupid or any thing but i cant help my self i just need to drink every nite and day other wise i think im gunna die or sumthing please can any 1 help as it is effecting my social life thank you my mate is the same as me but wont talk about it and im getting really concerned about her can you give me any tips to help her thank you


Member: Phil S
Location: MI
Date: 6/26/2003
Time: 7:55:02 AM

Comments

Until i was sick and tired, of being sick and tired; it was the SOS - different day. i knew about AA, it was the last thing i had wanted to do. i was afraid that the bible thumpers would ruin my life. i was completely insane. i somehow ended up at an AA meeting. i was drunk and drugged to the point of black out. An old guy named Ralph, got me home, and came over to my shack the next morning. Short version, i let him call the shots. After a week of the shakes, i was making coffee at the local group. He was driving me to meetings almost every night. He died with 25 yrs sobriety three years ago. i wouldn't be here without his help. i remember what he told me. Just take a little time and read through the posts, it's all in here somewhere. i go to F2F meetings and try to walk the walk, not just talk the talk. Thanks and Best wishes. Phil


Member: Kelly M
Location: NH
Date: 6/26/2003
Time: 8:31:37 AM

Comments

Mad, I was scared of the DT's too. I had them every day and at the end the only relief from the shakes and sweats was about a 3 hour window after about 6 hours of drinking. I went into a spin dry/ detox for 5 days. It was the best thing I ever did. I had a seizure on the 7th day but was with AA people and they followed the ambulance to the hospital while I got stitched up and had a Catscan. They got my car and brought my son to the hospital and were wonderful to me. I have been fine now for 9 months with no health problems. There is no shame in going to a rehab if you think you need it or can't quit on your own. Just plan on living in AA for a while when you get out and get the support and be quiet and listen and learn. Best of luck. Kelly


Member: wayne
Location: oregon
Date: 6/26/2003
Time: 12:14:00 PM

Comments

one day at a time,one min. at a time, one sec. at a time. I feel that each and every sec. of not taking a drink is something you as a person can hold on too. allright i,ve got one sec. oh now two sec. now 3 sec. and so on and so on and so on and pretty soon you,ll have a min. i thank god for each and every sec. of soberity in my life. at any rate i also find that the saying take it easy,helps me slow down, at times too get another sec.min.hour. I have found that what i do in that first sec. i think about drinking is the most important sec. of my life. anyway im wayne and im a alcoholic. and thank god for my soberity. I dont have too drink anymore. have a good one and keep coming back it works.


Member: For Markymark from
Location: Cali.
Date: 6/26/2003
Time: 2:33:51 PM

Comments

Well, hey--good for you admitting it. It's not that big of a deal and don't really see why people get upset at postings that bother them as it is sooooo simple to just scroll past them, what's the big deal? Anyway, I see a connection to AA in the cut&paste job about the liberals only because our entire culture is inundated with it, not just AA. It's sad to see in AA as well as the general culture but I do see it as being even more amplified because of the general AA mindset of not drinking is all that matters and (ANY)thing else goes. SEX, Politics, Religion, nothing matters in AA, except just not drinking. Very, very sad and yes I do see where whoever posted that article was coming from in relation to AA. Sorry, but that's the ways this kid sees it gang! Peace out my brothers and sis's.......


Member: siobhan
Location: washington
Date: 6/26/2003
Time: 2:38:43 PM

Comments

greetings, all. siobhan, alkie. on the topic of relapse, i follow the simple (haha) rule of "don't drink right NOW". i don't make plans not to drink at events or situations. take each moment as it comes and 'don't drink right NOW'. go to meetings, ESPECIALLY when you don't want to go. my biggest problem was accepting my disease as such. i am a bright, educated, responsible woman living in an enlightened age. i could not understand why i could not tame my drinking habits. i am a hard worker, willing to put the time and energy into taming my drinking, if need be. letting go was one of the hardest things i ever did. well, thanks for letting me spout off for a while. take care and remember....DON'T DRINK RIGHT NOW. God bless.


Member: Les
Location: S. D.
Date: 6/26/2003
Time: 3:45:33 PM

Comments

Cripes, is the subject Andrew. If so, who is Andrew?


Member: meinda t
Location: houston, tx
Date: 6/26/2003
Time: 5:42:46 PM

Comments

hello, melinda, alkie, i just now 2 days sober after 2 years of sobriety. i relapsed because i did not work the program, i did not go to meetings. i was on the road to the bottomles pit again. I had to surrender and realize that i could not fix this by myself (i am super woman). i asked god to keep me sober for one day, I am on day 2. i will keep asking for my daily reprieve. And rely on his will for me. I am one grateful drunk for AA, without this program i would be dead. Keep going to meetings.


Member: angie
Location: costa mesa cali
Date: 6/26/2003
Time: 5:45:03 PM

Comments

((mark h))) i was just wondering if you were from northern or southern cali .... i am from southern... i was curious ...cuz i know AA is very strong out here ..was wondering if theres as many meetings in northern cali as there is over here/...


Member: Mark H
Location: CA
Date: 6/26/2003
Time: 7:23:48 PM

Comments

angie... I'm from northern ca, and as far as AA meetings go... I can't speak for all of northern ca, but our fairly small town of Petaluma has a few different meeting locations.


Member: T. Roy
Location:
Date: 6/27/2003
Time: 2:02:06 AM

Comments

Hey folks. I came here tonight looking for some intelligent discussion on how to stay sober. You guys are too fucking long-winded----you babble on and on with a bunch of shit and half of it makes no sense!! Just say what you've got to say and make it short and to the point. And if you can't spell, pick up a fuckin dictionary and use it---otherwhise you look like a sober moron instead of a drunk moron!! Just take the time to read over your post before you submit it and maybe you'll save yourself from looking like an idiot!!


Member: Marco H
Location: Tacoma Wa
Date: 6/27/2003
Time: 5:06:09 AM

Comments

Bonjour, DP. I believe that you are right to be concerned about your friend's use of marijuana. Admittedly, marijuana poses less of a danger than most drugs, as there are no reported deaths from marijuana use itself, although there are collateral deaths from driving under the influence of marijuana, etc. The problem, as I see it, is that your friend is fooling himself into thinking use of one drug is alright, just so long as he doesn't drink. Such justification may lead one to believe that use of another drug is also okay. Pretty soon, one is drinking again or using another drug to his detriment and dies. It matters not whether you die from alcohol or another drug, you are still dead. I submit that you are either CLEAN AND SOBER or you are not. There is no in between. I see the same thing in A.A., where people think they are all right because they aren't drinking, but they are killing themselves with other drugs. The biggest culprit is tobacco. My friends who smoke think they are fine so long as they don't drink. And we all sit and watch as they die from cancer, heart attacks, etc. They are just as dead as if they died from alcoholism. But, they can't seem to quit smoking even for 24 hours, so they delude themselves into thinking it's all right - until the day they die. Just remember that CLEAN AND SOBER means 100% drug free - period. Thank you for your concern. God Bless You and all our Canadian friends.


Member: Susan A.
Location: Vernon, Connecticut
Date: 6/27/2003
Time: 2:37:32 PM

Comments

Hi all, I'm Susan and I'm an Alcoholic. I didn't like what I said above about not liking the word 'relapse'. I was intolerant and wrong in my thinking. Relapses are talked about in our Big Book. I still think they are a result of not taking action to stay sober. There are some references to relapse in our Big Book - In 'There is a Solution', self-knowledge as a way to stay sober is referenced: "...Above all, he believed he had acquired such a profound knowledge of the inner workings of his mind and its hidden springs that relapse was unthinkable. Nevertheless, he was drunk in a short time. More baffling still, he could give himself no satisfactory explanation for his fall." In "More about Alcoholism", loss of control is discussed: "... We alcoholics are men and women who have lost the ability to control our drinking. We know that no real alcoholic ever recovers control... We have tried every imaginable remedy. In some instances there has been brief recovery, followed always by a still worse relapse. Physicians who are familiar with alcoholism agree there is no such thing a making a normal drinker out of an alcoholic." Again in the same chapter, the mental state that causes us to think it'll be ok to drink this time is discussed: "...For those who are unable to drink moderately the question is how to stop altogether. We are assuming, of course, that the reader desires to stop...How then shall we help our readers determine, to their own satisfaction, whether they are one of us?...So we shall describe some of the mental states that precede a relapse into drinking, for obviously this is the crux of the problem." I want to follow tradition 3 in my dealings with other alcoholics and not be so rigid. Thanks for 'listening'. Love...


Member: Trisha W
Location: NE ohio
Date: 6/27/2003
Time: 3:12:25 PM

Comments

why dont you look for reasons to stay sober, rather than excuseses to get drunk. as im sure you have already figured out... if you justify an excuse to get drunk... to solve any problems or temporarily forget them... your problems are still there when you wake up the next morning. plus a hangover.


Member: mt
Location: usa
Date: 6/27/2003
Time: 3:28:42 PM

Comments

i thought this site would be helpful, i was wrong. people who are not tolerante are not going to understand relapse or be helpful to someone who is desperate.


Member: Ron
Location: Tired of listening to shit
Date: 6/27/2003
Time: 3:39:28 PM

Comments

Most of you on this post need to go to your nearest bar T Roy is right what a bunch of babbling shit.


Member: Jen B.
Location: SoCal
Date: 6/27/2003
Time: 4:06:57 PM

Comments

Angie in CM - there's a Thurs and Sun night in Sunset Beach that are fantastic - lots of sobriety and support. Get a directory or call the office and they'll direct you. So Cal is FULL of meetings everywhere, all day and some of the night. Sorry, I don't know what the topic is...so some ESH for the newcomers. The minute you've been in these rooms a second, someone will come in right behind you and you'll see where you were a few moments ago. You need only stay awhile for this to happen and for as they said to me if it doesn't work for you, your misery will be fully refunded. We can have the old life back anytime we want it. I needed to relapse to learn that, and when I returned, had to work to stay here. But the newcomers sustain me, that look in their eyes. Been there sweetie. The rooms of AA are like this thread: take what you like and leave the rest. If you need help, call information or check your phone book, look up Alcoholics Anonymous, and call the office. Help is right there for you, and you will not have to do it alone. Peace.


Member: DWAYNE S
Location:
Date: 6/27/2003
Time: 9:08:04 PM

Comments

TO ANY ONE IN RECOVERY NEW TO SOBRITY GO TO A MEETING AND ASK SOME TO HELP YOU OR YOU MIGHT AS WELL GO BACK TO DRINKING I AM NEW AND AM ASKING FOR HELP EVERY DAY I CAN ONLY SAY I WOULD HAVE DRANK IF NOT FOR THE SUPPORT ONLY BECAUSE I ASKED FOR HELP DAILY IF I DONT I WILL DRINK AGAIN SO IF YOU OUR AS NEW AS ME CET CONNECTD RIGHT AWAY YOU HAD NO PROBLEM ASKING FOR THE DRINK AT THE BAR OR SOMEONE TO BUY YOU A DRINK WAKE UP AND ASK FOR HELP IT MIGHT BE YOUR LAST CHANCE I KNOW ITS MY LAST CHACNE FOR LIFE YOU HAVE TO ASK TO GET


Member: ANDY
Location: KNOXVILLE
Date: 6/28/2003
Time: 12:20:45 AM

Comments

SOMEONE ASKED FOR A SIMPLE WAY OF LOOKING AT A GOD OF OUR UNDERSTANDING. TRY THIS ONE. GOD HAS MANY NAMES BUT IS ABOVE ALL NAMES. GOD IS EVERYWHERE IN THE UNIVERSE. THE UNIVERSE IS THE PHYSICAL BODY OF GOD. GOD IS AS MUCH IN ME AND YOU AS ANYWHERE ELSE. TO TRUELY KNOW AND LOVE YOURSELF IS TO TRUELY KNOW AND LOVE GOD. THE JOURNEY OF LIFE IS THE RETURN OF GOD TO GOD. I BELIEVE IN KEEPING THINGS SIMPLY INCLUDING MY PERCEPTION OF GOD. IF I KEEP THINGS SIMPLY I GENERALLY HAVE A BETTER GRASP OF THINGS - INCLUDING MY SOBRIETY. ME AND GOD - WE BE MATES.


Member: T. Roy
Location:
Date: 6/28/2003
Time: 12:49:19 AM

Comments

Hey Dwayne S. Are you a retard? Don't you even know how to use periods? Turn down the volume a bit---USING ALL CAPS MAKES YOU LOOK LIKE A NEANDERTHAL!!! Check your spelling. It's not like you're under pressure or anything; you've got plenty of time to check and submit your post. DAMN!!!


Member: mark m
Location: columbia tn
Date: 6/28/2003
Time: 1:01:10 AM

Comments

i think that this is the coolist way to help people from drinking just for today i can't always call someone in the middle of the night but i can cyber someone thanks (this is my first time doing this and i needed to talk to someone


Member: Rarely
Location: Canada
Date: 6/28/2003
Time: 2:44:36 AM

Comments

Hey Andy... crape like that is what scared the living bejesus out of me I got it ever Sunday morning at church and when I found alcohol I got away from your kind of preaching and preachers just like you. "No harm meant to you" So here in A.A. I was given the gift to choose a GOD that was personal to me. Im sure you were to. Don't vaunt your GOD in my face. He never done for me what my GOD done for me. One last point " You could say every thing that could be said about your GOD and I could listen and hear every word but I will never feel what you feel. All I can do is be happy for you, as Im sure you would be happy for me also. Yet your GOD and my GOD are most likly the one and the same GOD funny eh?


Member: Merv.
Location: Victoria
Date: 6/28/2003
Time: 3:04:24 AM

Comments

Where in the book of Alcoholics Anonymous does it mention " clean and sober " where do people come up with these wierd sayings. " 90 meetings in 90 days. and if that don't work try 180." sounds like a bunch of non'sense to me. Are these sayings in the N.A. program. Just where do they come from?????


Member: Heather
Location: UT
Date: 6/28/2003
Time: 4:53:34 AM

Comments

Merv, they come from hundred of thousands of alcoholics over many, many years distilling their hard-earned experience, strength, and hope into simple statements that even someone who is still drunk can remember. Try looking in the archives under "one-liners". Most people are a bit befuddled when they first stop drinking, and it's hard to remember where the keys are, let alone how to not drink, so the program is boiled down into simple statements that work with the Big Book to help keep us sober. Hi Diane, Angie! Newcomers: please don't run away because this room is temporarily undergoing turmoil. It happens and then it ends. There is a lot of ESH here and not everyone who reads here posts. Don't assume it's worthless until you've hung around a month or so. Snap judgements are rarely accurate.


Member: Car;c
Location: Tx
Date: 6/28/2003
Time: 5:18:51 AM

Comments

Here are some more beauties for you. If you dont drink you wont get drunk, fake it till you make it, wait for the miracle to happen, let us love you until you can learn to love yourself your right where your supposed to be, this one will get drunk or dead, dont drink, go to meetings, and call your sponsor. And people wonder why AA is so watered down.


Member: Johnny
Location: Palm Desert
Date: 6/28/2003
Time: 5:23:30 AM

Comments

If there is anyone thinking about drinking/using,well think it through. What will the negative consequences be? Don't laugh, sometimes it's that simple! Think Think Think. And stay sober/clean another 24hours. 1 day at a time.


Member: Kathy F.
Location: Texas
Date: 6/28/2003
Time: 10:20:17 AM

Comments

I'm Kathy, and alcoholic. "Don't drink and go to meetings" was how I managed to get a little sobriety. I also got a temporary sponsor. Then I started on the steps. My sponsor said that "all this other stuff" will take care of itself if I followed directions and for me, this turned out to be true. My relapses were a year apart and I was in a different geographical location each time. My sponsor wasn't much interested in them because it was clear I hadn't been following suggestions. My (hopefully) last time in was so different that I don't refer much to my other attempts. There are a few tricks I fall back on when I get the "feeling": I call to mind that there's nothing so bad a little drink wouldn't make worse; or if I happen to be near some booze when I get a wayward thought, I start reciting the first step and leave the area. In both instances, I also call someone as soon as possible and tell them what happened.


Member: mark m
Location: columbia tn
Date: 6/28/2003
Time: 1:44:47 PM

Comments

hello again, i have a problem my friend who i went through treatment with just told me that he is drinking he says it's ok because he went to treatment for snorting pills and that drinking is ok as long as he isn't snorting i tried to tell him that a drug is a drug and that he will go back to it soon he got mad at me and won't speak to me anymore or show up for aftercare either am i the blame for him not showing up for aftercare? did i push him out of aa/na? iv'e told nobody that he is drinking so nobody else knows this what should i do? i only have 45 days of being c/s what should i do


Member: J.R.
Location: Chicago
Date: 6/28/2003
Time: 1:56:53 PM

Comments

Yeah stupid sayings Like when Im offered a beer I reply " no the wife wants me home for Christmas." I guess I could say Im trying to stay clean. But who in hells half acre would understand that? What in GODS name would staying clean have to do with having a beer. Ive drank many beers. quit for as many reasons. but never because I diden't want to get dirty.


Member: Mary L
Location: Toronto Can
Date: 6/28/2003
Time: 2:03:33 PM

Comments

The old guy says to the young wipper snapper. " Ive spilt more booze down the front of my shirt than what you probable drank." The young fellow replys " I can't help it if your a sloppy drinker." lol


Member: June R
Location:
Date: 6/28/2003
Time: 2:14:35 PM

Comments

Hey Mark one quick way back to your life as a booze hound is... worry about everyone else and don't look after your self, If you can honestly say you are resposible for your friends actions Then how about taking the blame for me. I started drinking in 1953 never got sober til 1973 You want to be the blame for that. I have a few ex-wifes who would beat the dickens out of you for all you did to me. Get my drift


Member: John O'L
Location: DFW Texas
Date: 6/28/2003
Time: 2:18:24 PM

Comments

My name is John O'L and I am an alcoholic. I first came through the doors of Alcoholics Anonymous in the late 1970's. I'm not exactly sure of what year it was - I think 1978 or 1979. My last drink was in May of 1982. I had several relapses in between, and I think it was because: 1. I did not yet believe I was an alcoholic of the hopeless variety who could never become a social drinker, and 2. I kept blaming my excessive drinking on bad jobs, bad bosses, girls who didn't want to date me, friends who no longer wanted to hang around me, family members who kept bugging me about my drinking, police officers who didn't understand that I could drink and still drive just fine, thank you, etc. etc. etc. In short, I would say to myself that: "If it wasn't for this factor or this individual, or this situation (some person, place, or thing), then I'd be just fine and able to drink like any social drinker. In my case, it took years for me to accept that I am an incurable alcoholic and will be forevermore, and that it does not matter what else is going on in my life or in the lives of anyone else, the fact that I am an alcoholic will never change. In May of 1982, I became fully willing to accept in my innermost heart of hearts that I am an alcoholic and that if I want to live that I must take action. Please don't let a relapse lead you to despair and take you back on that hideous highway to a slow and agonizing death by alcoholism.....Go back through the doors of AA and accept the program with all your heart and soul! I find genuine help in the postings on this website, in The Grapevine, in the Big Book, at AA meetings at my home group (Compass in Irving, Texas)and at meetings at other groups, and wherever men and women who share their experience, strength, and hope thorough the program of AA gather. The program of AA works and offers hope to suffering alcoholics that they might have a sober and better way of life. This program has worked in my life for over 21 years, and I can assure you that if a real alcoholic like me can get sober and stay sober in AA, then it can work for you too, if you'll only give it a fair chance and try as much as you can one day at a time to work and live the program............God Bless all of you each and every day!


Member: mark m
Location: columbia tn
Date: 6/28/2003
Time: 3:07:44 PM

Comments

this is to june r i get your drift thanks for being to the point (no suger coating thats for sure


Member: Trollin
Location: The Site
Date: 6/28/2003
Time: 7:55:39 PM

Comments

T-Roy is right, you guys look and sound like a bunch of idiots. I've seen better grammar from 3rd-graders than on this site! Did all of you start drinking when you were like 9 or what? Just a little common decency for the English language is in order here as the pathetic state of 90% of these posts makes them almost illegible. Sad, very sad...........


Member: me
Location: USA
Date: 6/29/2003
Time: 1:13:59 AM

Comments

ok carl,, breathe in breathe out,,,hey lighten up man, what are you going to cure AA??? give it a break,, and ((RARELY IN CANADA))),, you still freaked out about someones idea of God ?? it didnt seem like he was pushin it on anyone,,you must be canadian i hear they cant handle relationships?no i didnt mean that ,,sorry ,,i guess just the canadian i knew,,


Member: JOHN
Location: Palm Dsert CA
Date: 6/29/2003
Time: 3:05:22 AM

Comments

John,Alcoholic: To Mark M, June is right, put your sobriety first. If you continue to worry about situations you don not have any control over, you will drive your self to drink/use again,let it go. Don't be so hard on your self,after all you were trying to help.


Member: Heather
Location: leahhmc1@hotmail.com
Date: 6/29/2003
Time: 4:42:09 AM

Comments

Mark M- which of the following applies to the situation with your friend: a- it's something to accept as something you cannot change, so you need serenity, or b- it's something you can change, so you need courage or c) do you need the wisdom to know the difference? My guess is a. To get help doing that, remember that YOUR sobriety MUST COME FIRST. You can't give what you haven't got. For a more detailed explanation, become a "double winner"- join Alanon as well. That's what I'm doing and I'm finding other people at the same beginner stage there. No matter what my friend does, no matter how much I love him, I cannot make him drink/use, and he cannot make me drink. Only I can do that, and I refuse to. It would be MY life that went down the tubes. I can't save him or damn him; only he can do that. Hope that helps. Prayers are with you, though; I know it hurts. If you need to distance yourself for a while to build up the strength to put you first (which you've got to do; this is a selfish program), do it. Do WHATEVER IT TAKES. If you want to email me, go ahead. I don't have many answers, but I'm glad to listen. Best of luck. Hi Angie, Diane! Susan, come to any conclusions about the jail/AA thing? To the person who believes that AA is a religion: I beg to differ. Go to a meeting or read the preamble to the AA Grapevine. "We are not allied with any sect, denomination, creed, or religion..." but this IS a program of spirituality (as opposed to carnality). In other words, we need something besides our physical desires to keep us sober. A religion is, by definiton, a group of people who worship the same god/set of gods. AA does quite the opposite. AA allows and encourages all to seek a power greater than oneself. If you truly believe there is no power in the universe greater than you, alcohol is the least of your worries. Perhaps reading the big book will clarify some of these things. What a novel concept....


Member: Rarely
Location: Winnipeg. Man. Can.
Date: 6/29/2003
Time: 6:49:01 AM

Comments

Rarely alcoholic, Relationships Yeah I could always handle relationships. Ill have you know Ive had five long term relationships in the past 2 1/2 months. When I came home after a ten day bender, my women was always waiting at the door with open arms hoping that I had a good time while I was gone, She was always happy to to see me. The kids always understood that my booze came before food and cloths. ( of course Im just pulling your leg ) they wrote on page 52 of the big book " We were having trouble with personal relationships, we coulden't control our emotional natures,we were a prey to misery and depression." etc. etc. A.A. gave me a GOD as I understand him. saved my life. gave me a life. and a wife who's name is Donna who just celebrated 21 years of sobriety, a week ago yesterday. That gives us over 51 years of sobriety in our home. I have never found a discription of the GOD that is personal to me in a bible, self help book or on a greeting card. if thats where you find an understanding of your GOD thats great Im happy for you. On the topic of relationships. When I was drinking I never knew what love was. Today I can't believe that at 67 years old. that I am head over heals in love with my wife. Ive done a lot of things in my life. but I never knew what I was missing until I found myself in love. Thanks to the fellowship of A.A. And a GOD as I understand him.


Member: Ruth
Location:
Date: 6/29/2003
Time: 7:10:05 AM

Comments

The 12 Steps of Alcoholics Anonymous showed me how to get sober and how to stay sober.Total acceptance of Step 1 had to be the starting point. I am 'powerless over alcohol'. Since I grasped the programme, it's interesting that my life is no longer 'unmanageable', maybe not always smooth sailing, but manageable, given the tools of recovery AA has given me. Step 11 recommends 'prayer and meditation'. I was told early on that prayer is talking to God (the God of my own understanding) and meditation is listening. AA is a spiritual journey. We start by stopping drinking and from that point on, it's about living. AA works. My first sponsor told me: Don't drink; Go to meetings; Alter my Attitudes -- and everything would get better. It has and it does. If you're new at this, stay around until the miracle happens!