Member: Glen H
Location: Denton, TX
Date: 2/25/01
Time: 9:54:35 AM

Comments

I shouldn’t pick the topic prob’ly, but after this last week, I’d like to hear about “love and tolerance is our code”.

When I first got sober, there was this lady with a some time who was a little off, IMO (I’m a fine one to talk, right?). Anyway, she’d ramble all over the place, completely off topic; occasionally, the chair might politely ask her to finish up, but mostly people’d just use that time to get a cup of coffee while she happily continued on.

I told this one friend that if that’s what sobriety does, no thanks, I’d rather just keep drinking. He said, well, you think she’s bad now, you should’ve seen her when she first came in. And I think that’s the deal: we’re all sick and trying to get better. In various stages of recovery. I believe that what my HP wants me to do is to try to help others along in that journey.


Member: sonia and cat
Location: uk
Date: 2/25/01
Time: 11:50:03 AM

Comments

Hello World

Nice topic (((glen))) I am still fairly new in the fellowship, when i first came i listened to everyone, and babbled on with my version, or where i was at. One person said to me "well at least your trying to understand the steps sonia". Talk about get a resentment, who the hell was she to patronise me in that way, I knew she was only trying to be helpful and let it go, still have problems tolerating this lady, as she often responds to my share, and i dont like it, she must have something i need to hear. But i find my self getting irritated at newcomers who dont know the rules, and interupt shares, then i shift that anger on to the person that twelve stepped them cause they should of told them. i had a particularly bad case of this with one person who was trying to get sober in the rooms, I actually cried after one meeting becuase thier understanding of serenity was so wrong (for me), i just wanted to jump up and drag them out and talk to them, I guesss i thought they looked like a fool, something which must hold deep fear for me. I hope they never saw this in me. I hope i adhered to the principles, i would of hated for him to have been able to hear my thoughts, I knew he was just trying to get sober. I have an awful lot to learn about tolerance and the frustration in me that lack of tolerance causes. I havent done step four yet, but i do try to be tolerant, it is something i work on, but i work on loving me too, cause then i feel love for others, then life just isnt the hard work it can sometimes be.

insane.sonia@ntlworld.com


Member: Heidi P
Location: Argentina
Date: 2/25/01
Time: 11:54:56 AM

Comments

Hello everybody, I´m Heidi, alcoholic. I´m surprised to be the second one here to comment. I just started coming to this site because I am traveling in south america and not finding meetings easily, so this is my connection to aa right now--besides my friends in the fellowship at home. Anyway, thank you to those of you who come here and help me to keep sober and feel a part of aa, even when I feel so far away. On the topic, this triggered memories for me of people in the rooms just like Glen described--not well. I hadn´t been around long enough to see their progress, so I felt the same way as he did. Then there was Eddie. I was in my first year when he came in, living off the street, a regular street bum who sleept in doorways. People who were sober longer than I was said that he was pretty close to being a wetbrain, so it was a real miracle that it made it to the rooms. They suggested that I watch him, that I would learn a lot. I have to say that this experience of watching Eddie progress in sobriety is one I will never forget. He did get better, he carried a strong message, and was the clearest example of a miracle that I had ever seen. I was not able to show him much love then, because I was afraid. The best I could do was to not turn off when he spoke, or leave the room, or use that time to get coffee. I would remind myself that God works through people, ALL people, and that maybe Eddie carried a message just for me on that day. God works in mysterious ways. Enough from me. God bless you all trudging this road with me.


Member: Mike L.
Location: NW Iowa, USA
Date: 2/25/01
Time: 11:58:53 AM

Comments

Hi All,

"Love and tolerance is our code"

Interesting and timely choice of topic, Glen. I think I need some work on this one. (read: LOTS lol) Over the time I have been in AA, I feel I have managed to use this more and more often in situations which would normally have made me blow up/leave/lash out/etc. in a face-to-face situation.

I find I usually have tons of tolerance and love for a newcomer, and can smile and urge them to continue with their sometimes disjointed shares no matter how "out there" it becomes. Usually giving out my phone number and asking them to use it. For some reason, I find it harder to extend the same open hand to people with lots of time sober. Especially someone whose main form of sharing seems to be monologues about how AA has gone down the tubes, and was SO much better when they got here.

We've had some discussion recently about the anonymous "kiddie posters" and whether or not to utilize some kind of blocking or censoring of them.

I was in the corner of getting rid of them until a lady who's relatively new to AA/here, and has been the target of some of the worst attacks yet spoke up against such a move.

THAT was a growth moment. It kind of reminded me just what that love and tolerance thing is all about.

Like I said, I need work on it...

Peace, Mike L. mjlyons@uswest.net


Member: Patti D.
Location: Florida
Date: 2/25/01
Time: 1:42:27 PM

Comments

I remeber going to AA along time ago with a friend of mine who at the time "had a drinkng problem" I was there for support , I didn't think I needed it ! I did get alot from the program and walked away with much needed stregnth, This friend of mine would sometimes leave the meeting and after me dropping her off I would find out that she would go out and drink . I had to have alot of patience, love and tolerance to this day she will not admitt that she needs help but I guess all I can do is love and do what is needed for me now.


Member: LeAnn W.
Location: Idaho
Date: 2/25/01
Time: 1:48:41 PM

Comments

Hi everyone! My name is LeAnn and I am a very grateful alcoholic. I love the topic. It's one I can always use reminders on. It is so easy for me to put personalities in front of principles. Meetings like this remind me of my priorities. I need to remember that "love and tolerance is our code" does not only apply to just inside a meeting room. It applies in my life. Everywhere I go, so goes that code. Sometimes the easiest place for me to practice this is at a meeting. In my life are many different types of people. Some in recovery, some not. Regardless, they all deserve to be treated with love and tolerance. I also believe this code includes myself. Sometimes I just need to be loving and tolerant of me. I change what I can, but unfortunately that doesn't always mean changes occur instantly. Thanks for the meeting and a great topic. I needed both.


Member: Derek B,
Location: Manchester UK
Date: 2/25/01
Time: 2:12:10 PM

Comments

Hi all my name is Derek, I'm an alcoholic. Can't handle booze very well. In fact I'm almost a total liability-a person whose alcoholic advancement was to end at the point where I was a lack of control drinker rather a loss of control drinker. All considered this is besides the point-personal powerlessness is personal powerlessness no matter how far down the scale each of us goes. So I find it difficult to tolerate those alkie friends of mine who say to newcomers things like you don't look as bad as me when I first came to AA. How do they know how badly damaged an alkie is if we measure personal deterioration not only in terms of the physical but take into account the mental and spiritual as well, particularly the latter.

It could very well be that those guilty of this are those who also say that AA isn't religious. Does it say anywhere in the BB that this is so? I don't think so. In fact, to the contrary, page 19 specifically states that "of necessity there will have to be discussion of matters medical, psychiatric, social, and religious". There is even a whole chapter dedicated to agnostics urging them to reconsider their reluctance, I suppose.

So as you can see I have many faults and fault-finding is one of them. But I just find it intolerable when I hear the chant that AA isn't religious. But maybe it is more religious than we perhaps realise if we consider this quote I took off a website.

"..... let's look at the difference between Religion and Christianity! Religion is Man seeking God, Christianity is God seeking man.

Sorry for my diatribe. I thank you for tolerating me. God Bless.

derekbeattie14@hotmail.co.uk


Member: Gail
Location:
Date: 2/25/01
Time: 2:29:58 PM

Comments

Love and tolerance is a great topic. I'm grateful for the AA message Live and let live. In the step book (somewhere) it talks about how bad gossiping is for us. This is something I need to be constantly on the lookout for in myself. Somewhere else in the step book it talks about how all people, including ourselves, are to some extent emotionally ill as well as frequently wrong. How about that! I thought I was always right! So, my sponsor told me I had the right to be wrong and so did everyone else. Think about it. I used to get so mad at people I thought were wrong. Thank G-d I've learned a little bit in the program. I hope I am more tolerant today than I was when I came in these doors, and that I always am growing. The 11th step prayer helps me - I have to always emphasize one part that I tend to forget - it is better to understand than to be understood.

Thanks for the great topic!


Member: Pam B
Location: Daytona Beach, FL
Date: 2/25/01
Time: 2:30:18 PM

Comments

Hi, I'm Pam, an alcoholic,

"Love & Tolerance is our code" is one I have done lots of work on, and still fall so very short from the mark. Progress, not perfection, as long as I keep on keeping on.

For me, I notice I still tend to have no problem with my own little circle of friends & loved ones - but that is not always the case with those outside that little circle. My goal in recovery that I always aim toward is the ability to love "all" others with acceptance as is. I've come a ways, but as yet still see a very long long ways to grow in that area.

At meetings I have love & tolerance for the majority now, but at times there can be one or 2 that will get to me, or I want to reach over and give them a good shaking and "waking them up" kind of thing.

I saw first in the beginning that my intolerance toward most others had been because I did not like things about them, that I didn't see till later in the Steps, are same exact things I disliked in myself.

Then I saw the truth behind some intolerance I'd had toward others were FEARS in me - things like thinking I was threatened in some way by them, or jealousies and the like.

And lack of love and acceptance for my own self exactly as is, came out of me as lack of love & tolerance toward others as is.

Principles before Personalities works best applied for me when I see it as "Principles before MY Personality" . . .taking an inventory of myself to find the cause. As Step 10 tells me - whenever I am having a problem with any other person, I am the problem.

Enjoying the good stuff on this topic so far. Thanks. Pam


Member: BilliJo
Location: Chinook
Date: 2/25/01
Time: 2:36:48 PM

Comments

When I first got sober there were some people who were right in my face about where my head was stuck and their belief that I'd didn't have a chance one to get and stay sober. It was very confrontative. I don't know if I needed it or not, I don't know if all hugs and nice-y nice-y woud have had any different results. I am sober.

But, later, in a different town, when I responded with the same as what I had been 'hit' with in the early days, I was told I had to be tough on myself and tolerant of others. Hmmm.

I think now, that I need to accept people (yah, places and things, too) as being exactly where they need to be. I can tolerate them in a meeting. I do not have to tolerate inappropriate behavior in my persona ife outside of AA. But, inside, I 'get' to tolerate all kinds of behaviors, words, and actions that are tough to take. Why?

Because I 'get' to love the unlovely until they are lovely and can love themselves. And 'they' can be 'unlovely' in a multitude of ways.

One of the things I like best about AA is the unconditional acceptance of me, regardless what I've done, said, did, do. And because the AA people tolerate me, I have a place to go, to get sober, to learn - eventally to give back the same 'love' and acceptance (tolerance) that was given to me.

Yes, I do think some people need their butt kicked sometime. And by kicking their butt, or telling them that's where their head is stuck, is not necessarily being intolerant.

The code of tolerance is not all hugs. But it is all 'helps'


Member: Melissa B.
Location: Canada
Date: 2/25/01
Time: 2:37:26 PM

Comments

I'm Melissa, an alcoholic, and tolerance has been on my mind lately. It's darned difficult for me to be tolerant.

At one of the meetings I go to, there was a woman who just... bugged me. I found her painfully annoying. No, that's not true - I FIND her painfully annoying. My sponsor had been pretty clear on this subject and I looked for what bothered me about her within myself. I haven't found it. Maybe I will and maybe I won't. I don't know. I include her in my prayers in a grudging fashion. One day last week, she was again at this meeting, and again I had the same feelings, and after the meeting, I said to a woman who I know quite well who's been sober for over ten years or so, 'G_____ really bothers me, and it's bothering me that I feel this way.' She sort of raised an eyebrow and said 'Melissa, if you like everyone in AA, you're not going to enough meetings.'

I'm not sure why, but that took away the problem for me. Maybe I was practising perfection again. 'Must like everyone or I'm doing IT wrong'....In my heart, I wish this woman well, and I certainly wish her sobriety and recovery, I just don't want to be around her much. And I guess I don't have to be. (She probably doesn't think much of me, either...)

Anyway, I feel lighter on this particular subject now, no more berating myself because I don't like G___. I've heard that we don't have to like everyone, but we have to love everyone. It doesn't feel like I love her, but it does feel like I can tolerate her. I've got a feeling this is about how I feel about myself.

I'm so grateful to be sober, there are no words. Love to all who come here from Melissa


Member: TP
Location: Ireland
Date: 2/25/01
Time: 6:11:24 PM

Comments

Love is tolerance. Am I correct in thinking that AA is no different from our ordinary day to day lives, in that we meet people who we may not necessarily like but choose to tolerate or at least get along with. Is that not simply a civilised way to live. I think that the whole ethos of the AA movement is based on tolerance and that is it's great strength. I'm just doing the best I can today and thank you for your help.


Member: Phil A
Location: Geordieland UK
Date: 2/25/01
Time: 6:58:50 PM

Comments

Love and Tolerance is our code, thanks for the topic Glen. I always thought when I was out there that if someone disagreed with me then they had it in for me, today I can agree to disagree. I don't necesarily like everyone in AA but I love them all. Tolerance and Patience is something we all have to a greater or lesser extent, much definatly lesser when your out there chasing that elusive magic and watching it ebb further away.

GeordieWally@aol.com

Peace and Serenity to all


Member: Jim K.
Location: West Texas
Date: 2/25/01
Time: 7:36:09 PM

Comments

Hello out there! Jim here--alcoholic in recovery. What a great topic--love and tolerance!

In the Big Book (pg. 84) it says that, "Love and tolerance of others is our code." I have found that this must be true in my life from day to day. After I set out to make my amends to those people I have harmed, my sponsor told me that in order to stay sober, and have some success in my recovery the inventory process. I must make a conscious effort every day to review my conduct and behavior, and make immediate amends. I must also continue to strengthen my relationship with others in recovery and with my higher power, which I choose to call God for lack of a better word.

I still have nearly all of the character defects that I came into the program with, but through learning to live the steps in my life, these defects are becoming less and less powerful. It says, "Our real purpose is to fit ourselves to be of maximum service to God and the people about us." (BB pg. 77) When I darkened the doors of Alcoholics Anonymous the first time, I believed that if I could just quit drinking and doing dope, I would be okay. This turned out not to be the case at all. I found out I was a thief, a liar, a con, and a dirty son-of-a-bitch. And all of this was due to my character defects, not the booze/dope at all! This program has taught me how to be a better man, and to treat other people with a certain amount of kindness, tolerance, and patience--all of which amount to respect.

I am still a son-of-a-bitch, and I fall back into self-will now and then. But staying in touch with the program by going to meetings, talking to my sponsor, praying, and reaching out to help other folks keeps me on the right track.

Thank you for letting me share with you, and thank you for my sobriety.


Member: Lee P.
Location: IL/WI Line
Date: 2/25/01
Time: 8:22:50 PM

Comments

To me, every alcoholic we hear in a meeting whine and otherwise annoy us is a microcosm of what we must guard against in the outside world, so that we can remain sober. As we, through the Fellowship, learn love and tolerance for those who go off on rants or otherwise "misbehave", we also learn to better do the same in the real world outside the safety of the meeting room.

If nobody in the room annoys me for three or four meetings in a row, I go find a meeting with someone who will..

It's like lifting weights. The more we do, the stronger we get...:)


Member: Toddy
Location: New Mexico
Date: 2/26/01
Time: 12:37:32 AM

Comments

Good topic! I remember this guy who'd come into the meetings and gripe about all he'd lost and how he'd love to get drunk/drugged up again, etc. He'd smoke his cigarettes like a joint, no kidding, he'd suck it right up! It bothered me so much to see him fighting the program so hard and not really trying to get it. He would last about 1 - 3 months, then go back out, end up in jail, then come back to us. This went on for a couple of years. I don't know what happened to him exactly, but he's now been sober for 6 years and you couldn't meet a finer human being. He told me once that he just quit trying to 'work' the steps, that he learned to 'live' the steps. And it happened for him! There are many I could describe as miracles in my home group, myself included. We need to realize that along with trying to sober up we are all still just people. Personalities don't always click, so I try to tolerate those that come to AA for help, and usually that tolerance turns to love. I find myself eager to hear what a person has to say when at first I was one of those who'd head off for coffee when I saw that same person start to share. I guess it's also a kind of acceptance, isn't it?


Member: Gary K
Location: Alberta
Date: 2/26/01
Time: 12:43:38 AM

Comments

Hi,I'm Gary & I'm an alcoholic.

Wow what a wounderful forum, an international topic meeting. I've learned to love and tolerated eveyone in AA, I may not like a person but I have learned to love them for what they are trying to do, stay sober.


Member: Robert J.
Location: Burley, ID.
Date: 2/26/01
Time: 1:40:05 AM

Comments

I'm an Alcoholic and my name is Robert.. Welcome those new.. Glen great topic.. Love and Tolerance is something I still have to work on.. It is one those Defects of Character that I came in with and I'm glad I still have cause I know I have to continue to work.. I have to say that last night in this room I found I was irritated by a person or a couple of people and kinda let him or them have it.. I need to make an amends for that but, at the same time I have say that what was said by this person or people was not needed here.. Leann Where in Idaho are you from.. You can E-mail me and my fiance who is also a part of the fellowship.. Again great topic and I'm greatful I still have my Defects of Characters so I don't get that delusion of wellness.. Love and Sobriety to all..

tazzie102@hotmail.com


Member: Pattu D.
Location: Florida
Date: 2/26/01
Time: 9:33:47 AM

Comments

Staying sober is my main goal and to love and respect myself as well.


Member: Stephanie
Location: Canada
Date: 2/26/01
Time: 10:57:08 AM

Comments

hi I'm Stephanie,alcoholic,7 months. Good Topic! I find it hard nowadays to go to meetings as diligently as i used to in the beginning of my sobriety. I find excuses such as "it's too cold outside, I have schoolwork, some people bug me", etc...but deep down inside I know that I have to keep up w/it. The Book says we have to practice love and tolerance for all. It's my new found AA goal. Thanks.


Member: RT
Location: Glendale
Date: 2/26/01
Time: 11:27:27 AM

Comments

Love and tolerance. Well, I'm having to deal with love at the moment. My relationship with my girlfriend is not going well. Finding hard to make a serious decision on it.


Member: Mrellan
Location:   Colchester, UK
Date: 2/26/01
Time: 11:56:24 AM

Comments

Love and Tolerance! When I could not do this or even consider it I also could not stand the sight of the person that looked out from the mirror at me either. I was married when I got sober and I hated him almost as much as myself. We got sober together--tell me God doesn't have a sense of humor!! Four years later he had the unmitigated gall to die on me. Thank God I have also had some very good sponsors along the way who loved me without feeling sorry for me. AA taught me a lot about love, tolerance and relationships. Early on someone told me the first person I have to learn to love and tolerate is myself. After my husband died I was strongly advised to spend some time getting to know myself without the interference of relationships with other men. I decided to give myself a minimum of five years to find out who was behind the face in the mirror. It was the smartest thing I have ever done--also the greatest gift I have ever give myself. Five years streched into eight then a few months ago I again married. This man is a "normy" and doesn't have a clue what it means to be alcholic. I approached this marriage with a belief that I had conquered my greatest problems with relationships--ie love and tolerance, and I/we would live happily ever after. Now I am again reminded that the ego never dies! I have not graduated to perfection, just moved to the next level of the spiral that is my living sobriety! I am so glad--it keeps me humble!


Member: Martina G
Location:
Date: 2/26/01
Time: 6:13:28 PM

Comments

My name is Martina and I'm an alcoholic. Today I am grateful for my sobriety and grateful for all of the love and tolerance others have shown to me, especially in the early days of sobriety when I was anything but lovely or tolerable. I owe that back to every addict that comes across my path. But I often forget that. God has given me His grace freely; undeserved and unearned. How can I justify doing less for others? I can't. It is usually my perfectionism and unrealistic expectations that causes me to be impatient with others. I struggle with this and then when I am reminded of all of these things, I can be grateful for the reality check. This is a great topic.


Member: William,A
Location: High-Point.
Date: 2/26/01
Time: 6:52:27 PM

Comments

Hello,William,A-alkie.

Yes Glen I also thank you for the topic,I do not remember what the topic was last week-- but I can I.D. with what you shared about and fpr me your message was load and clear. I would like to always rremember the way it was in the beginning for me,because I went threw a lot of up,s and dowm\ns early on and because of the - topic as wellas some understanding recovering people I had met at the early meetings I attended some one grabbed me by the hand offered me a cup of coffee and spoke with me in a manner that helped me to be still and come back even though it was some people at the meeting that told me in some uncertain terms that I could sit down shut up and listen to the brand of soberiety that they were selling I have since met most of those same people at some of the meeting that I attend ed before I moved to where I live now and a lot of them are either just comming back or only in the early stages of thier recovery and by GODS love and grace I will soon be sober (10) years ,remembering that any success I may be having is the success of GODS and not mine ---- ( I have been giving a free ride on the raeding I wouyld not pass go to collect the (200.00) prize that awaited me if I chose the short cut to misery.

Thank s for the topic,see you when I see you, LOVE AND TOLERENCE must be our code.


Member: lu-lu
Location:
Date: 2/26/01
Time: 8:44:37 PM

Comments

rt dump her!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Member: shopping carts
Location: the race is on
Date: 2/26/01
Time: 9:20:52 PM

Comments

supermarket sweeps is on yiiippppiie


Member: legrandplayer
Location: ottawa ontario
Date: 2/26/01
Time: 10:00:38 PM

Comments

sober 12 days now.....whoo hoooooooooo


Member: Fran W.
Location: Chicago
Date: 2/26/01
Time: 10:35:16 PM

Comments

I have just started Fellowship on line and it has really opened up new ways to continue to keep me sober one day ot a time. I am so grate ful and I know this is just one mre tool I allways say I need alkl the tools that I can get.God has blessed me with a strong desire to stay sober Openmindedness and a willingness to keep learning and staying grateful for each day.


Member: Phil D.
Location: Dayton
Date: 2/27/01
Time: 12:38:06 AM

Comments

Hi everyone, Phil D. alcoholic. DOS 14 March 95. Long-time lurker, some-time poster. Great topic. AA has taught me to become friends with people I would never have given the time of day to (or who would have never spoken to me either.) Alcohol may be the great leveler, but so is the program when properly implemented. Today I can greet people both in the program and out, who I really don't care for, with a smile and a how are you- and really mean it. Today I can, (most of the time) arrive at my destinations reasonably calm and serene without having the urge to flip someone off. People are actually starting to flip me off in traffic now. Does this mean I am getting better? :-) Through a bit a self-examination I have found that those I like the least are often those who are similar to me and my actions/mouth/thinking. When I focus on their character flaws, I need not work on mine. I hope I don't get in trouble with this, but somewhere in the Bible, St. Paul states "live peaceably with all men, as much as lies within you". To me that says I don't have to like everyone I know, but I should, to the best of my ability, tolerate and love them. I must be off. Have a great day ODAAT


Member: cary B
Location: NJ
Date: 2/27/01
Time: 3:34:56 AM

Comments

Hello, my name is Cary and i am an Alcoholic. I am having issues with love and tolerance as we speak. My wife of 7 years and i are not going well. I am trying to show love and tolerance towards her but the return is not there. In fact it is getting worse. I can't do anything right when it comes to her. I have been trying to keep things upbeat in my life and look towards the positive since I finally surrendered but since I am now sober I have "ruined her fun" even though she urged me to stop drinking. I originally came to AA this time around for her and my folks, but after relapseing over and over I finally saw the light I am a drunk and will die if I keep going down that road. I am here for me and no one else. Sometimes reality is hard. Thanks, for listening.


Member: Jason B.
Location: Wi
Date: 2/27/01
Time: 7:12:04 AM

Comments

:)


Member: Patti D
Location: Orlando
Date: 2/27/01
Time: 10:50:40 AM

Comments

Talk about Love and Tolerance I am a step mom to be of three teenagers, I sometimes want to scream but I then stop and think of the positive things I could do to help the kids. Love and Tolerance you got it.


Member: Babette R
Location: Jerusalem, Israel
Date: 2/27/01
Time: 10:58:36 AM

Comments

Hi this is a good topic for me. My mom is visiting from the States and it is teaching me tolerance not to focus on her negativity and complaining. It's hard not to let her ppush my buttons, but I like myself better if I don't react. This is my first sober visit with her so I'm suddenly aware of behavoir, attitudes that I never noticed before. It's like "Hell--oo" I'm very grateful for this site and thanks for letting me share.


Member: lu lu
Location: strip joint
Date: 2/27/01
Time: 12:32:15 PM

Comments

my name is lulu thats right im a stripper


Member: rt
Location:
Date: 2/27/01
Time: 1:40:24 PM

Comments

my name is rt,im a male hooker.

he/she i am


Member: carol A.
Location: il
Date: 2/27/01
Time: 2:16:29 PM

Comments

"love and tolerance" first hello to all,first time here. love and tolerance is a never ending growth process that we must exercise to keep healthy,which goes hand in hand with a positive attitude,when I first learned that I had to join AA...wellI said noway not for me, but I have come to see that God is so much a part of this as he is in a chuch and I have learned wonderful tools and attitudes which is only for my better good, or the better for those who have to be around me/o/


Member: alt
Location:
Date: 2/27/01
Time: 8:43:25 PM

Comments

im just grateful to be alive today ..used up all my quota for drinking and drugging really. Earth Coincedence Control has sen to it I keep grounded and firmly rooted in reality these days.


Member: Philomena
Location: So. California
Date: 2/27/01
Time: 9:09:54 PM

Comments

Hi,Philomena alcoholic,a lot of good input here,but most of all THANK YOU! ((Derek B)) Manchester UK FOR... Difference>< Religion and Christianity Religion is Man seeking God. Christianity is God seeking man.

Tolerance & love. A very good topic,I have had to really practice this with a sponsor that I just had to release my self of her control. I have had to pray for the guidance to move on in the program to find another sponsor that will guide me and direct me in giving back what has been freely given to me. I felt so hurt & rejected by a final statement from my exsponsor. If I didnt go to the meeting she set up for us that she would no longer sponsor me. After alot of writing & meditating and speaking to alot of other women who have good sobriety & work the program. I was able to forgive her in my heart & send her a thank you card for all she has done for me. And that I will always have a special bond with her & her family.& said, God bless you. I haven't been able to call her yet. It still hurts. I was hoping she would call me. But I accept what is at this time and continue to pray for her. I am too sensitive to talk yet, I know I would probably cry if I called. I have gone through the last 3 years working with her so closely, did all of my steps with her. This was my whole sobriety she knows of me. I just cant understand this decision/ultamatetum of hers. Of course I had to make the final choice. I have a 50 hour week job. I am also sponsoring 2 women and have 2 other commitments in the program. I need the weekend days for balance in my life. I am trying to balance the program and live life on life's terms. One day at a time. Sorry if I carried on. It is the subject that brought me here. I hope all of you have a good rest of the week. Take care,God bless you all,love, Philomena


Member: lu-lu
Location:
Date: 2/27/01
Time: 9:24:53 PM

Comments

i love to love myself,but my fingers get sore.

lu-lu


Member: Fran D.
Location: Maryland, USA
Date: 2/27/01
Time: 9:28:08 PM

Comments

Wow! Thank each of you for your wonderful meeting! This is my first time here. This has given me strength, and again a sence of belonging. I too must be reminded as today that love and tolerance is not just to be practiced in A.A., but throughout ALL MY AFFAIRS. This is so easy for me to leave out of my daily program. Progress is what I strive for and some days I forget that others too are "striving" also and have not perfected this thing either. I am grateful for this place to share and to be shared with. I will return. Love and Peace, Sojourner


Member: David R,
Location: Southern, Va.
Date: 2/27/01
Time: 9:58:50 PM

Comments

My name is David and this day nine of Operation Get out of the clouds, after 16 years of seeing life through the bottom of a Budweiser or Wild Turkey bottle. As I undersatnd it, the topic is still love and tolerance. I can remember my mom telling me even at a young age, that I did not have any patience. I think I finally figured out what she was talking about. It has always been difficult for me to tolerate anybody or things for any length of time, because I had to be in control. The ironic thing with this and recovery is having to stop loving and tolerating something, the booze.

It is difficult for me to attend local A.A. meetings for professional reasons and my career. I appreciate the opportunity to read (listen) to others in this forum. I welcome E-Mail to help each other along. I know I need it. groberts@kimbanet.com


Member: Tricia Mc
Location: massachusetts
Date: 2/27/01
Time: 10:21:17 PM

Comments

This is my first visit to this site...LULU needs to grow up.As alcoholics we are here to support one another to build the strength to keep ourselves sober..David, good luck, you got nine days...tomorrow I have 9 months...You can get here too, one day,one minute,one second at a time...ask for help. Congrats!


Member: Barry L
Location: PA
Date: 2/28/01
Time: 12:52:40 AM

Comments

AA isn't religious

AA isn't religious

AA isn't religious

oops AA is religious - End Chant

Hi I'm Barry I am an alcoholic

I have learned from the program that I can disagree with someone but still tolerate them.

When I read Dereks post above I started fuming, because in my mind "religious" automatically means "christian" which AA definitely is NOT. But instead of replying to him right away I researched his statement.

My dictionary defines;

Religious: 1, of religion

Religion: 1, belief in the existence of a superhuman controlling power, especially of god or gods, usually expressed in worship.

According to that definition Derek is 100% correct AA is religious. AA is a spiritual program of recovery, without a belief in a power greater than myself I cannot stay sober for any extended length of time.

In my experience, my first 12 years around the rooms of AA, some of them in the bible belt, I thought I heard people say AA was christian, and being an atheist could not tolerate any such philosophy to combat my alcohol problem, as a result there was no way I could get beyond Step 2, so I continued to get drunk.

When I came around the last time, I was near death physically and spiritually, I knew I had to get the god thing to stay alive, but how. Then I actually read the Big Book, it was especially chapter 4 "We Agnostics" that really open up the doors for me, lines like page 47 that say: "When, therefore we speak to you of God, we mean your own conception of God" this chapter showed me that AA was indeed a spiritual/religious but that I CHOOSE my understanding of god.

This is where the beauty of tolerance comes in, I was told in meetings I can only share MY EXPERIENCE, as I have done above. Today I can accept and tolerate someone sharing THEIR experience, because I have learned if there are 2 newcomers sitting in a room, one maybe a lapsed christian the other may be an atheist, and I have no crystal ball which tells me who needs to hear what, So someone may share that Jesus is their God, then I share my understanding of a Higher Power, and maybe both of those newcomers will have heard what they needed to hear. The fantastic thing about the way the Program of AA is set up that it allows both experiences to be heard. Today I can accept others religions and experiences, and try to love them for what they are.

A quote I often heard in the Rooms goes like this; "religion is for people who are trying to find god, spirituality is for those who already have"


Member: Tim Y
Location: Reno
Date: 2/28/01
Time: 2:39:17 AM

Comments

Hello everyone, this is my first time visiting online AA. I have been to regular AA meetings but did not care for them much. I think this will work much better for me. I'm 5 days sober and hoping to stay that way. Thanks for your comments and letting me share mine.


Member: Cherise L.
Location: Bloomsburg, PA
Date: 2/28/01
Time: 7:57:56 AM

Comments

Hi I'm Cherise and I'm a grateful alcoholic.

Thanks Glen for the topic. Luckily I learned about love and tolerance very early on in recovery. Shortly after I got sober I was homeless and lost, and the state took away my 15 month old daughter from me. There was one woman who was my case worker who continously told me that I was "Shit" as a mother, I was a 'loser" and much more horrible things on a daily basis. I went to five metings a day for the first 4 or 5 months and what I was told was pray for her and read page 449 in the big book over and over again. I cried and cried and was angry for a long time. My friends now tell me they tried to avoid the meetings I was at because they were sick of hearing me whine. (Thank God they had tolerance and love for me then) even though I was annoying.

It wasn't until I surrendered myself to God and truly believed in the program that no matter what this woman said or no matter what was going on if I continued to do the next right thing and keep praying and going to meetings,that I was going to be all right. It was a very hard lesson to learn at the time, but it has carried on through the years of my recovery and I am so grateful for it all.

God usually puts these things and people in my life because I need them. I need bricks to fall on my head to teach me about my defects, it's never an easy thing and always comes with pain, but in the end the lesson is learned.

I really never had to much of a problem until my husband and I moved here. I shared recently about AA here and again, I recently surrendered to God the whole thing and we finally were able to have a business meeting which was very successful. Hope is definetly on the way. It's always so simple, and I can complicate the heck out of any situation.

A good friend of mine taught me early on and would say "Allow people their defects" and whenever I think I might be feeling some intolerance that is played in my head.

For me it works if you use the tools. I guess I'm growing because all of this stuff going on in the site I have not once wanted to be a part of the negativity and mostly, don't allow this kind of stuff to rent space in my head. It's ironic, we started this meeting a few years ago for people who couldn't get to live meetings or were sick, and now it seems God knew we would need it more that ever now. I love sobriety and I love God and most of all, you guys for helping me to continue to stay sober with love and tolerance.


Member: Patti D.
Location: Orlando
Date: 2/28/01
Time: 10:12:05 AM

Comments

Tricha you are right one day one minute one second, Pray about it.


Member: tony g
Location: ma
Date: 2/28/01
Time: 12:40:04 PM

Comments

live and let live....love and tollerate?the way i see it "good will" starts with me.to be kind and fair to all people is the way to go...i stick to the 12 steps of the program,i think it becomes a spiritual program.the books to read,the meetings to attend,the power of prayer and meditation all make it possible for me not to drink today...to love and tolerate seems like alot less work than hate and discord.i know that i couldn't stay stopped on my own,so i better learn how to tollerate.. or?....thanks for being here,tony an alcoholic


Member: AZbill
Location: Arizona
Date: 2/28/01
Time: 3:58:26 PM

Comments

HI Family. Bill here. An alcoholic from Sierra Vista, Arizona. I was taught very early on, that if I could tolerate the shortcomings of others and if I could hold a repect for their opinions, then I could be more useful to God and to my fellow man.

I really had to work at putting aside my prejudices, especially those I had against organized religions. I was fortunate to have a very enlightening experience early in sobriety. I was approached by a gentleman to join an Episcopal Mission nearby. (I am a confirmed Episcopalian). I refused with the age old cliché "Too many hypocrites in there." He told me I was right. There certainly were a lot of hypocrites in the church. But there is always room for one more. Ouch !!

I realized right there and then that I talked a lot about tolerance while all the time being intolerant myself. About the church and a lot of other areas of my life as well. So I went against all advice heard in AA today and said the prayer from the 9th Step by asking my Creator to show me the way of patience, tolerance, kindliness, and love (p. 83 end of first paragraph).

I still do not attend church barring weddings and funerals, but today I am quick to see where religious people are right. :)

And a big thanks to those who have emailed me.

Bill

az-bill@primenet.com


Member: SEATTLE
Location:
Date: 2/28/01
Time: 4:23:28 PM

Comments

EARTHQUAKES SHAKE THE WEST


Member: jj
Location: south carolina
Date: 2/28/01
Time: 6:32:22 PM

Comments

Love and Tolerance --- Good Topic. In my 4th year of sobriety and nearly a saint; I got the degree on this one. The third degree that is from my Higher Power. Let me explain. There was this one fella in my homegroup that really got on my nerves. So being polite, I would excuse myself to the bathroom or the kitchen for coffee. This went on for months. After all why should I stick around and get a resentment for no reason. He never stayed on the topic; but rather just rambled on about God only knows what. ( Obviously I didn't know -- since I was not in the room.) Anyway, one day I decided to impress God with my spiritual development. So I made myself sit there as I looked upon him with pity and nodded in the right places. Then "it" happened. The missing piece of my sobriety just fell from his mouth as though he had been repeating it forever. I felt the blood rush to my face as I realized the extent of my self-rightousness. That one phrase he stated is still the most important thing I learned in AA. After that day I never left in the middle of a talk, spill, lead, or joke. Because I never know just who God will speak through. One day it might even be me.


Member: Antsy
Location: with baited breath
Date: 2/28/01
Time: 8:21:21 PM

Comments

Hey JJ I am breathless with anticipation..

What was the phrase??????


Member: sherri M
Location: S. Texas
Date: 2/28/01
Time: 9:55:53 PM

Comments

Hey everyone,just Sherri here. been sober going on 6 years and this program never ceases to amaze me. I have been "missing" actual physical meetings Here around where I live largely due to intolerance that I developed. The group started getting real picky and stuff about letting people talk so I just left. Live and let live as one other person says. I live out in the country so I talk to the stars ie.,god a lot and pray a lot and simply journal and am truly grateful for my life. I have found that my tolerance level for alcoholics,druggies is minimal. I have seen so much BS not to mention all the games people play.Guess I am hardcore.My only real interest is in staying sober for me cuz it is a pretty cool life these days.Thanx everyone and hope to read on next week.,Take care and god always be with you, Sherri


Member: the real LU-LU
Location: 1 hint, some people felt the earthquake all the way over here, (i did'nt)
Date: 2/28/01
Time: 11:38:46 PM

Comments

HEY((((((((IMP))))))) QUIT WITH THE PORNOGRAPHIC IMPOSTER POSTS,WILL YA.i can't "tolerate" it I don't "love" it.... and even though they are at times quite witty... YOUR GONNA GIVE ME A BAD NAME...TE HE HE, AAH HA HA love and tolarence great topic... te he he.. I'M BAK!!(((((DEREK B.))) WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU BLABBING ABOUT, READ THE LITERATURE.(just the black) quit taking crap out of context. have you not heard?" God,as we understood him". alcoholics annonymous is NOT allied with any sect or denomination (bla bla bla) i've run into a FEW athiests, over the years SOBER! Why, one just died on christmas eve(ironic,i know...) he had about 18 years it happened while he was on the crapper... I'M NOT KIDDING. that sorta falls into the catagory of(readers;wag your head & plug your nose to say -->) "MY GOD HAS A SENSE OF HUMOR"...you hooo ((((GLENDALE GUY)))))) If she did something REEEEAL mean to you i have a "suggestion" on how to retaliate...(he he he) DO HER SPONSOR! ( make amends later...) te he he. just playin' good luck, i'm sure you will be O.K. how ever it goes........................................................................................ don't forget everone, "LOVE AND TOLERANCE IS OUR CODE" te he he AND the topic....ALOHA


Member: the real LU-LU
Location:
Date: 3/1/01
Time: 12:56:02 AM

Comments

(((((((tim)))))))) maybe you might try to be willing to check out a few more meetings. it worries me that you think the computer will keep you sober. how can you find a sponsor if you won't go to meetings. this is "the net" real meetings will help you maybe you can call central office and describe the "kind " of meeting you would like to go to. congratulations on 15 days that is really good, your first year is very important, please try some more real face to face meetings, i bet if you do 90 meetings in 90 days you will find at least a few,you'de be comfortable attending REGULARLY. Meetings sometimes bother me too, but i know that if i don't go the odds are very high that i will drink, i believe this whole heartedly cause when the "relapser" comes back they most ALWAYS say,"I QUIT GOING TO MEETINGS." good luck little newcomer, hope you read the beautiful big book, the 12&12 is real easy reading check um out .. love LU-LU(the real LU-LU)


Member: the real LU-LU
Location:
Date: 3/1/01
Time: 12:56:27 AM

Comments

(((((((tim)))))))) maybe you might try to be willing to check out a few more meetings. it worries me that you think the computer will keep you sober. how can you find a sponsor if you won't go to meetings. this is "the net" real meetings will help you maybe you can call central office and describe the "kind " of meeting you would like to go to. congratulations on 15 days that is really good, your first year is very important, please try some more real face to face meetings, i bet if you do 90 meetings in 90 days you will find at least a few,you'de be comfortable attending REGULARLY. Meetings sometimes bother me too, but i know that if i don't go the odds are very high that i will drink, i believe this whole heartedly cause when the "relapser" comes back they most ALWAYS say,"I QUIT GOING TO MEETINGS." good luck little newcomer, hope you read the beautiful big book, the 12&12 is real easy reading check um out .. love LU-LU(the real LU-LU)


Member: Michael B.
Location: AZ
Date: 3/1/01
Time: 1:03:40 AM

Comments

Hi! My anme is Michael, and I am a recovering alcoholic and addict, sober today only by the Grace of God and the Fellowship. Welcome newcomers! Congrats to those celebrating continued sobriety! Thanks to those who genuinely shared!

Love and tolerance is an excellent AA tenet that helps discourage, among other things, intolerance and hatred in our Society. One challenging part of love and tolerance for me and other AA's is, for example, when to cut people off from speaking at a meeting, as in the example Glen gave.


Member: I'M AN ALCOHOLIC AN ALCOHOLIC AN ALCOHOLIC AN ALCOHOLIguess who...     
Location:  
Date: 3/1/01
Time: 3:34:14 AM

Comments

I'M RASPUTAN,the frequent relapser,I'M AN ALCOHOLIC AND AN "ADDICT" I'M NOT just an alcoholic, I AM AN "ALCOHOLIC AAAAND AN "ADDICT" MY disease is way worse than yours, cause you are JUST an alcoholic BUT ME? I'M AN "ALCOHOLIC AAAND AN ADDICT." I'M DIFFERENT, I HAVE ABSOLUTELY NO KNOWLEDGE OR REGARD FOR "SINGLENESS OF PURPOSE" AND NIETHER DOES MY SPONSOR.THAT DOES NOT APPLY TO MEEE. "PRINCIPALS BEFORE PERSONALITIES?"NOT BEFORE MY PERSONALITY. I'M GONNA DO IT MY WAY. WHO CARES IF THEY RARELY SEE A PERSON FAIL WHO thoroughly follows thier path, I KNOW ,THERES NO "S" AT THE END OF PATH, BUT I KNOW MY WAY WILL WORK. CAUSE I'M DIFFERENT I'M NOT only AN ALCOHOLIC I AM AAALSO AN "ADDICT!AND I HAVE TO SAY THAT ,FOR MEEE. CAUSE IT IS, ALL ABOUT MEEE,YOU KNOW."PRINCIPALS BEFORE PERSONALITIES? CAN'T POSSIBLY INCLUDE MY OWN. .....


Member: Charlie Darling
Location: Key Wset Fl
Date: 3/1/01
Time: 6:20:45 AM

Comments

Good morning family Charlie Darling a very gratful recovering ALCHOLIC, and this is the first time in awhile since I have been here, and with the topic, is what I need to hear every day, as today is my 4th anniversary and I am very gratful to all of you for helping me to stay sober one day at a time. Love I may not like a person but I do love them and tolerate, there has been quite a few I could not tolerate in the beginning, but found out I got more from them, and was able to use what thay had shared when the appropiate time came, and this program works it really does. I believe that Pam from Daytona Beach said everything I would have said, and I just want you all to know I may not know all of you but I do Love all of you, and I listen with an open mind and heart as you are all the ones who help me stay sober today, and I thank all of you for keeping sober and helping to find my sanity. I LOve You all HUG HUG HUG kwduke@keysdigital.com. I Still can't believe that I have come this far in the past 4 years and I will keep coming back as I like the person I am becoming, and this day I really am grateful more than I usually are.


Member: mark f
Location: Dallas, Tx
Date: 3/1/01
Time: 8:46:18 AM

Comments

My Dad is an alcoholic. I love hime but he is hard to tolerate when he is drunk.

As a recovering alcoholic I can't forget I was just like him at one time.


Member: Doug  R
Location: Maryland
Date: 3/1/01
Time: 10:26:54 AM

Comments

Where would I be with out it ? Unlike some people I was scared when I came into the rooms. I wasn't the tough guy I pretended to be. I wanted to be loved but just didn't want you to know that.Thanks to my Higher Power and all of you who loved and tolerated me when I came in I am still here. And now that I've been given this gift it has been suggested to me to give it away.(Damn) I hate to give away something that I like, but in doing so I get even more back.(now I'm hooked) Practicing Love and Tolerence in ALL of my affairs has allowed this thief to give something away rather than take it. It has allowed this hater of everything and everyone, including myself, to love everyone including myself. It has allowed me to ask you what I can do to help instead of asking what can you do to help me. Last but not least it has allowed this alcoholic to stay sober one day at a time. So thank all of you for your love and tolerence and I know I'll keep coming back. P.S.My Higher Power loves you and so do I


Member: (((((((((imp))))))))
Location:
Date: 3/1/01
Time: 11:41:05 AM

Comments

hey lu-lu, your back!!!!!!!!!!

i promise never to smut your name again,(tee-he-he)...........i like them earthquakes(they rock) !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

(((((((()))))))))


Member: Chris H.
Location: Fla.
Date: 3/1/01
Time: 2:03:09 PM

Comments

Chris Here: Alcoholic/addict/bulimic/ Great meeting all! I had no trouble with tolerance the first three years of my sobriety... I was so greatful to be in the rooms and so afraid of not listenening to everything that was said that I had no trouble. However, now that I have been out of meetings for acouple of years because of health problems, I find when I go back I seem to have a trouble with intolerane. This meeting has reminded me how greatful I am for all of the love and tolerance I was given in the beginning of my sobriety . I can certainly return the favor to those in the rooms now. It is part of my 12th step work.. A.A> is such a fantastic place to be accepted and loved back into health . Surley I can be part of that solution !!!!Love to all...One more 24 hrs.!!!


Member: the real LU-LU
Location:
Date: 3/1/01
Time: 3:45:16 PM

Comments

hey chris ,when you carry "the message"does it include "singleness of purpose" &"principals BEFORE personalities" they have other programs to to address eating disorders, and "addicts" come on are you really THAT different.... how bout just being a "member among members"


Member: j giles
Location:
Date: 3/1/01
Time: 3:51:29 PM

Comments

hhummmmmmmmm dingers


Member: the real roo
Location:
Date: 3/1/01
Time: 3:53:22 PM

Comments

lu lu is this really you , im happy to see im the real roo thanks for the post very positive


Member: the real roo
Location:
Date: 3/1/01
Time: 3:53:26 PM

Comments

lu lu is this really you , im happy to see im the real roo thanks for the post very positive


Member: do be do
Location:
Date: 3/1/01
Time: 3:54:04 PM

Comments

doo beee doo,la la la eeee hee hee aahhh ha ha


Member: do be do
Location:
Date: 3/1/01
Time: 3:54:12 PM

Comments

doo beee doo,la la la eeee hee hee aahhh ha ha


Member: do be do
Location:
Date: 3/1/01
Time: 3:54:15 PM

Comments

doo beee doo,la la la eeee hee hee aahhh ha ha


Member: LU-LU-alcoholic-alcoholic(sound redundent ? )      alcoholic alcoholic
Location: SO DOES "alcoholic-addict"
Date: 3/1/01
Time: 4:01:02 PM

Comments

((imp)) missed ya, whats a 'real roo' is it a KANGAroo, is it a BUCKAroo is it a KOO KOO roo? well i'm off to pay my mortgage, i'll check you later, AT thepot, would not want to ruffle anyone serenity at this 'meeting' luv lu-lu(the REAL LU-LU)


Member: areebadarechee
Location:
Date: 3/1/01
Time: 4:02:44 PM

Comments

aROObadoba............get alife roo be scoobe

ah-ha-ha-hatee-he-he


Member: (((((((())))))))
Location:
Date: 3/1/01
Time: 4:05:03 PM

Comments

ok lu-lu.......

c-ya-at-da-cp


Member: ((((((())))))
Location:
Date: 3/1/01
Time: 4:06:41 PM

Comments

oh yea, i think its a scoobieROO!


Member: jj
Location: south carolina
Date: 3/1/01
Time: 4:17:58 PM

Comments

Antsy --- The phrase: "If I want God to work for me then He needs to work through me." I suppose this is the St. Francis prayer in a nut shell. (12&12 p.99)


Member: wouter
Location: neth
Date: 3/1/01
Time: 4:18:02 PM

Comments

wouter, alkie, topic is love and tolerance. i wrote a letter the other day to a longtime ex- of mine. it was in my early twenties and i felt so mature then but looking back i was a real cheat. i didn't love meself because i didn't kno who i was. but i drank lots of beer and smoked lots of pot and when i was around my ex- i acted very sober, i played a game with meself, the mature-man -game: that is not love, is it ? it is lying, cheating, it is alcoholic behaviour, its the behaviour of an addict. denial etc etc.

hell, i was a little sob that was allowed to vote. i wrote her a letter explaining the man i was and the man i am. i thanked her for all the love she gave me. love and tolerance, everything points to ourselves. love your self and the rest will follow. thanks for reading, bye


Member: Bill P
Location: Victoria B.C.
Date: 3/1/01
Time: 5:33:00 PM

Comments

I may not love everyone but it is absolutely imperitive for my sobriety to treat every member long time short time high bottom low bottom duel addiction single addiction with COMPASSION AND RESPECT> Bill P Victoria B.C.


Member: FRED
Location:
Date: 3/1/01
Time: 8:46:15 PM

Comments

THEY SAY THERES NO LIFE LIKE LOW LIFE


Member: Lori R.
Location: CANADA
Date: 3/1/01
Time: 10:53:28 PM

Comments

Lori, alcoholic here. I just want to thank everyone who posted. I needed to read some of this stuff. I really liked the post about "we all have the right to be wrong". Grateful I found this site.


Member: JEAN
Location: Canada
Date: 3/2/01
Time: 12:01:37 AM

Comments


Member: jean
Location: canada
Date: 3/2/01
Time: 12:02:31 AM

Comments


Member: Jeff
Location: Northern CA
Date: 3/2/01
Time: 1:17:13 AM

Comments

Hi My name is Jeff and I am an alcoholic. I was sitting here thinking for a few after reading the shares. What was my code when I was drinking? What was it like? I know it was not love or tolerance. If I had a code it was probably work hard and drink hard. It was miserable for me. and lots of trouble.

Love & tolerance is on p. 84 with Step Ten. For me step ten is the continue continue continue step. Progress is sometimes slow. I am not as quick to act unloving or intollerant but I still think that way often ...I can't start acting differently until I can think differently , It takes effort on my part and help/guidance from some power greater than me (meetings, literature, God). AA is a gift.

Thanks for the topic and to everyone here.


Member: these crunchy cheetos are DEEEELICIOUS
Location: crunch crunch crunch
Date: 3/2/01
Time: 2:55:09 AM

Comments

CRUNCH CRRUNCH CRUNCH


Member: Tim Y
Location: Reno
Date: 3/2/01
Time: 6:50:31 AM

Comments

Thanks Lu Lu, I'm willing to try anything to remain sober.


Member: TiffanyB
Location: Leesburg, Va
Date: 3/2/01
Time: 11:20:17 AM

Comments

Thanks ((Glenn)) I have learned so much from this topic. Love and Tolerance are something that I need a lot of help with. I am new to AA and I suppose I would be one of those that drive you "old timers" crazy, but I can't help that; everyone has to start somewhere.

I have only recently stopped drinking and I have found myself to be very edgy at times. The courts have ordered me to stop drinking and even though I want to a part of me is angry that I can't do it for myself. But I can, cant I? This anger I have can be controled if I get a better understanding of the Love and Tolerance right?

In my personal life things are crazy. I am a BI..H to my boyfriend all the time. I tolerate nothing and yet I love him very much--kind of doesn't fit the rule does it. I hope that over time I will be able to apply the Love and Tolerance rule to all aspects of my life, not just the drinking.


Member: razzle dazzle
Location:
Date: 3/2/01
Time: 11:32:26 AM

Comments

i like crunchy,munchie doritos.


Member: LU-LU
Location:
Date: 3/2/01
Time: 12:38:56 PM

Comments

HI (((TIM)))))) good for you, how many days do you have today? 16? don't let anyone convince you that"time don't matter"it does! so i'm hoping when you say you are " Willing to do anything" It WILL include reading the beautiful big book,and the 12AND12,REGULAR attendance at meetings,a sponsor,doing the steps,learning the traditions, being of service.WOW that MAY sound like a tall order but for me(and lots of others) it IS "the softer easier way" it really beats the 'stuff I had to do' when I was drinking,you know, throughing up, crashing cars, fist fights, getting kicked out of places, losing jobs, my husband, credit cards, money, friends ,SELF ESTEAM,DIGNITY,RESPECT,HOPE it sucked. this A.A. stuff is way better for me.IT WORKS if YOU work it.. good luck, luv lu-lu


Member: Fred M
Location: MD
Date: 3/2/01
Time: 1:47:40 PM

Comments

I'm Fred and I'm an alcoholic, sober today by the grace of God and the AA fellowship. The opposite of love and tolerance is hate and intolerance, and that is what I practiced when I was drinking. I was self-centered and extremely angry and intolerant of anything that interfered with my primary interest, which was drinking by myself. Then, in sobriety and with prayer to my higher power and by practicing the 12 suggestions of AA, I learned to identify my defects of character and work to improve. I notice the change today is not that I do not occasionally have feelings of hate and intolerance. I do, since I'm an alcoholic with many defects of character. What I notice today is that I identify those occasions quickly and look inward and to God for the cause. I've learned that it is usually me or something in me that causes these thoughts and behaviors, not what someone else has done. Then, after a while, the answer comes to me and I am able to shorten the time I stew in these feelings, and return to a spiritual condition more fitting to the principles of AA and the person I think God wants me to be. Thanks, God, for saving my life, and thanks, AA, for showing me how to live. Thanks for letting me share. Love, Fred


Member: patti D.
Location: orlando
Date: 3/2/01
Time: 3:08:42 PM

Comments

I am still hanging in there are you?


Member: Von
Location: OH
Date: 3/2/01
Time: 3:11:03 PM

Comments

Thanks for all your comments. When I started reading, I smiled because the "love and tolerance" issue has come up this week, big time. There is a person in the program who took a dislike to me from the start. My sponsor would tell me to leave her alone and do nothing. Almost two years later, this person continues to be a thorn in my side. Because of love and tolerance, we communicate and share, but I am constantly aware of her dislike. 3 months ago, she ran into my brother (who isn't in the program) and told him something I had mentioned in a lead. He was confused and I was pissed. My sponsor told me because a principle had been violated, I needed to talk to her and set matters straight after I cooled off. I talked to her about why I felt it was inappropriate for her to share that information with my brother and how it hurt him and affected my anonymity. She was very annoyed and lashed out at me, but it still felt good to explain my truth in love. Last week, word came back to me that there was a new rumor that she was spreading about me. I was hurt, but not pissed. I talked to my sponsor and we agreed that if I tried to defend myself, I would be working on an ego basis and trying to protect my pride. The program has taught me that pride gets a lot of us in trouble. So the decision was made to do nothing but continue to love and pray for her. It doesn't feel comfortable, but it feels sincere. I pray everyday for everything that I want for myself to also go to her, health, happiness, joy, love, peace, prosperity, and so on. And it gets easier to do.

The other day, my sponsor told me she was proud of the way I have acted, that by showing my integrity, I am showing how the program works in my life in all my affairs. Then she gave me a fresh perspective. She knows that I am still struggling with the relationship with my mother. She explained how the way I was working with this person would help me deal with my mother in the long-term. That sometimes what happens in the rooms helps us address similar situations in other parts of our lives. How neat it is that this woman can actually become my greatest teacher. What a sense of gratitude I felt. All of a sudden, I didn't mind her behavior because I was motivated to use it to learn how to handle similar situations with integrity.

There are no bad examples in this program. Everyone becomes a teacher in one way or another and for that I am very grateful. Love and tolerance teaches me to build a life of integrity. Without certain situations happening, how else could I ever learn?


Member: Jaclyn H
Location: New Jersey
Date: 3/2/01
Time: 5:15:02 PM

Comments

Love and Tolerance great topic! I am sober from alcohol since December 10 but other addictions are still a problem. Love being one of them. I have very low self esteem and meeting a male seems to help that for the five minutes that I spent with him. I know that I have to stop this and work on self esteem issues but eating disorder also does not help me. I am in counseling and go to AA meetings to help with my addiction to laxatives and men. I hae decided to spend some time on here to possible discuss my problems. I hope I am in the right place!!!!!!


Member: Lori S
Location: NJ
Date: 3/2/01
Time: 7:49:23 PM

Comments

Lori recovery alcoholic addict here,Hi Jaclyn, you are definetly in the right place. Thank you everyone what an incredible meeting this has been. Love and Tolerance as usual always perfectly on target,( I always seem to get exactly what I need when I need it if I show up ) As I sit here reading one fantastic reading after another my young twelve year old daughter comes into the room to ask me if I'm OK! Talk about blessings from all sources.

I'm recently engaged to a man I really adore, who may or may not be nothing more than a potential alcoholic, but I am so scared! Petrified! As we all know where there is addiction in any form there is definetly alot of other issues that come with. Tolerance/Love I am struggling to keep those two with me, in every thought, otherwise FEAR takes over.

I don't know today/so I will do nothing and just wait for some clarity.

Love the perspective on people and meetings. Been having alot of trouble with this. You know personality and politics. It's all so very childish and stupid eventually I will make my self present at Physical Meetings again.

Thanx


Member: LU-LU
Location:
Date: 3/2/01
Time: 11:56:26 PM

Comments

(((((((JACLYN))))))))) over eaters annonymous is for people with EATING DISORDERS,i.e. overeaters(of course) barfers, starvers, etc. people who find a sense "RELIEF OR CONTROL"by abusing themselves with (or with out) food, AL ANON, helps us deal with other people in a"healthier" way. ALCOHOLICS ANNONYMOUS, is for people who are alcoholic i.e. they drink, and everything sucks the 12 steps are "universal" so it is easy to adapt them to all these oyher "A's" N.A., O.A., G.A.,S.A.,and although the steps and traditions have been passed around each "membership" sorta puts thier own spin to ot... why, N.A.'s often behave as though THEY made the whole thing up...never the less what i'm saying is A.A. WORKS, but when i quit smoking, i went to "smokers annonymous" and when some alcoholic is interfering with my serenity I find myself attending ALANON... I went to an O.A. mtg. once.by mistake... i don't qualify. my first sponsor goes though.and they do thier "thing" a bit different too. Sounds like O.A. might help you and also alanon if you are getting yourself into wierd,or disruptive,relationships. good luck, 4 months is tuff.hang in, things will change, and remember the more program related stuff you do (i'm not talkin' just meetings!)the higher the chances of a happy recovery. luv lu-lu


Member: LU-LU
Location: TO THE oh so different,unique, and most likely eventually drunk,"alcoholic ADDICT"s "
Date: 3/3/01
Time: 12:22:57 AM

Comments

PRINCIPALS BEFORE PERSONALITIES,,,,,, PRINCIPALS BEFORE PERSONALITIES,,,,,, PRINCIPALS BEFORE PERSONALITIES,,,,,, PRINCIPALS BEFORE PERSONALITIES,,,,,, PRINCIPALS BEFORE PERSONALITIES, that includes MY personality.(and YOURS)SINGLENESS OF PURPOSE, SINGLENESS OF PURPOSE, if you don't know what it means, ASK AN OLD TIMER!! your sponsor obviously does NOT have a clue OR you would not be identifying as an "ALCOHOLIC ADDICT"


Member: LU-LU
Location: TO THE oh so different,unique, and most likely eventually drunk,"alcoholic ADDICT"s "
Date: 3/3/01
Time: 12:23:02 AM

Comments

PRINCIPALS BEFORE PERSONALITIES,,,,,, PRINCIPALS BEFORE PERSONALITIES,,,,,, PRINCIPALS BEFORE PERSONALITIES,,,,,, PRINCIPALS BEFORE PERSONALITIES,,,,,, PRINCIPALS BEFORE PERSONALITIES, that includes MY personality.(and YOURS)SINGLENESS OF PURPOSE, SINGLENESS OF PURPOSE, if you don't know what it means, ASK AN OLD TIMER!! your sponsor obviously does NOT have a clue OR you would not be identifying as an "ALCOHOLIC ADDICT"


Member: LU-LU
Location: TO THE oh so different,unique, and most likely eventually drunk,"alcoholic ADDICT"s "
Date: 3/3/01
Time: 12:24:33 AM

Comments

PRINCIPALS BEFORE PERSONALITIES,,,,,, PRINCIPALS BEFORE PERSONALITIES,,,,,, PRINCIPALS BEFORE PERSONALITIES,,,,,, PRINCIPALS BEFORE PERSONALITIES,,,,,, PRINCIPALS BEFORE PERSONALITIES, that includes MY personality.(and YOURS)SINGLENESS OF PURPOSE, SINGLENESS OF PURPOSE, if you don't know what it means, ASK AN OLD TIMER!! your sponsor obviously does NOT have a clue OR you would not be identifying as an "ALCOHOLIC ADDICT"


Member: Mike M
Location: Bend,Or
Date: 3/3/01
Time: 1:30:53 AM

Comments

it is a spiritual axiom....pg 92 12x12 could we then foresee that troublesome people were to become our principal teachers of patience and tolerance...pg 145 12x12 there is a principle...pg 570 BB


Member: Rich R, slowly recovering compulsive person :-)
Location: Detroit
Date: 3/3/01
Time: 6:23:51 AM

Comments

I am a member of AA, my name is Rich R and I am an alcoholic. But, I am also a member of Gamblers Anonymous. It is from GA that I want to relate to the topic.

Like AA, GA has it's share of 'characters' (who knows, I may be one of them). But I heard a GA member say once 'if you can't learn patience and tolerance in a GA room, you probably never will learn it.' I thought that comment was neat. It put a positive spin on a relatively negative situation.

I loved Melissa B's quote about if you like EVERYONE you aren't going to enuf meetings! Thanks for letting me share here.


Member: AnilG
Location: Mt Vernon,ILLINOIS
Date: 3/3/01
Time: 9:38:49 AM

Comments

i am an alcoholic and an addict. first time when i was introduced to AA I believed that being an alcoholic was a curse and that there is nobody who wants to talk to u and u are alone in this world then came the love of God /caring and sharing of fellowmen in AA which I cherished as of this date and I am very thankful to them there support 'cause it ment a lot to me when i needed it most.

during my drinking years i had very little patience making peopl around me very uncomfotable and angry at times relationships got affected and ruined now with love and tolerance it is changing AA has done a lot to turn my life around.


Member: umm im not telling!
Location: bedroom
Date: 3/3/01
Time: 1:00:55 PM

Comments

hi i am an alchoholic and an addict,i have 3 days again, taking it one second at a time and struggling all the way. through meetings and such i get the strength not to drink or drug for that moment. and now since i have found this on-line thing, perhaps will have the strength not to drink or drug for the rest of the moments of my day haha! thanks for letting me share...alchoholic addict.


Member: mark p
Location: northern plains
Date: 3/3/01
Time: 1:34:19 PM

Comments


Member: mark p
Location: northern plains
Date: 3/3/01
Time: 1:45:36 PM

Comments

the only area i beleive i have trouble with in love and tolerance,is my ability to tolerate the individuals who refuse to seek help for their desease or the ones who absolutely refuse to let me speak my mind to them about my opinion on their situation you know the ones in denial it bothers me terribly to not be able to reach them i just have to learn to worry more about my own troubles and let them discover sobriety on their own {you can lead a horse to water but you can`t make him drink!} thanx for hearing me out


Member: Bill M.
Location: Southeast Georgia
Date: 3/3/01
Time: 5:43:24 PM

Comments

Bill, Alcoholic Glen, Two days after I talked about this topic a lady moved into the condo next to mine. In the past year "the tolerance testers" in meetings have been easy to take. The partying starts about 11:30 p.m. getting louder .... Yesterday, she rang my door bell and asked for a ride to her therapist's office. She was to drunk to drive. I was ready to step into the shower and had my robe on. My answer was "Give me five minutes". She will be going into treatment Tuesday, for a refresher course. I've already had mine. Be careful what you pray for.


Member: milt
Location: nORTHWEST usa
Date: 3/3/01
Time: 6:37:06 PM

Comments


Member: Milt
Location: Northwest USA
Date: 3/3/01
Time: 6:44:10 PM

Comments

Hi All. My name is Milt and I am an alcoholic. I hope I can get some help and guidence from all of you. I'd like to get my life back on track! Thank you for listening.

Milt


Member: Mike K
Location: Ski country
Date: 3/3/01
Time: 6:47:13 PM

Comments

Wow.This is just what I need.1 day sober....seems I just get bored. I don't tolerate people very well.I have ISSUES!!! Oh well....I'll just go skiing.


Member: rod
Location:
Date: 3/3/01
Time: 6:58:24 PM

Comments

me too i hate everyone,i too have issues today, the serinity prayer over and over,its not helping my head today.help


Member: Milt
Location: Midwest USA
Date: 3/3/01
Time: 7:09:15 PM

Comments

HANG IN THERE ROD. one day at a time. I know it is hard! I'm struggling too! Take care & God Bless!!! Take one minute, hour, or day at time. Take Care,Rod Milt


Member: Milt
Location: Northwest  USA
Date: 3/3/01
Time: 7:21:55 PM

Comments

I just went to a meeting today & it makes me feel great. I just want to thank the group for being so supportive! I know I have an ALCOHOL PROBLEM & want it to go away forever! I'm SICK & TIRED of it ruining my life! Thank you for listening! Milt


Member: Milt
Location: Northwest  USA
Date: 3/3/01
Time: 7:22:15 PM

Comments

I just went to a meeting today & it makes me feel great. I just want to thank the group for being so supportive! I know I have an ALCOHOL PROBLEM & want it to go away forever! I'm SICK & TIRED of it ruining my life! Thank you for listening! Milt


Member: colleen n.a
Location: adirondacks
Date: 3/3/01
Time: 8:47:54 PM

Comments

hito all my fellow miracles, this is my first time viewing this incredible site.it is great for me because i am a single mom who doesnt get to alot of meetings.i have a little over 4 years and am extremely greatful everyday,every moment.excellent topic glen,i had no love or tolerance for people when i first came in because i was so angry,no more alcohol to dumb my feelings.i thank my lord and savior jesus christ for teaching me that love and tolerance through the years.if i dont ha ve it for others,how can i expect others to be tolerant of me and my neurosis.sometimes it is not easy but it helps if you say the serenity prayer and you pray for the many blessings you want to be besowed on that person that annoys you.god bless all recovering addicts and the still sick and suffering outside as well as inside the rooms.love is the greatest gift you can give to someone according to the bible. love all you little miracles. colle


Member: LU-LU-ALCOHOLIC
Location:
Date: 3/3/01
Time: 11:35:36 PM

Comments

hey,(((((("umm i'm not telling))))))alcoholic "addict"))))))))) ... 3 days huh? again? huh.. ever wonder why you can't "GET THIS THING"???? don't tell me, you went to "treatment,and they told you "you're an "alcoholic addict"... the beautifull big book, says rarely have we seen a person fail who has thoroughly followed OUR PATH. notice path has no 's' on the end. Dr. Paul the guy from "doctor,alcoholic addict", in an interview with the grapevine(Thats A.A. approved literature,Pamie..)SAID HE IS VERY DISAPOINTED AT THE MIS-INTERPETATION, OF HIS STORY, SAYS he never identifies as "an alcoholic addict" that is probably cause he knew about AND respected "SINGLENESS OF PURPOSE" and was wise enough NOT to place his personality before THAT principal. ever notice 99 out of 100 cronic "relapsers" insist they are unique, they are different they are'nt JUST an alcoholic like the rest of the room,thier an addict too. whatever, fu&%& N GEEKS,... DRUNKIN GEEKS, get over your self like none none of us "just alcoholics" never smoked a joint,ate shrooms acid,crystal,free based, or heroin,what ever....KEEP DOIN' WHAT YOU ARE DOIN' YOU'LL KEEP GETTIN' WHAT YOU BEEN GETTIN'... DRUNK


Member: Phil D.
Location: Dayton
Date: 3/4/01
Time: 1:07:56 AM

Comments

Hey lulu why don't you tell us how you REALLY feel? Love and tolerance was kinda the topic if I remember correctly. I don't think that LULU, Alcoholic, Advisor sounds much better than Doctor, Alcoholic, Addict. I also don't believe these people are asking for your OPINION I think they are crying for HELP. There is a difference between tough love and just being a tough. Lighten up a little bit. Just because you may have had a step-Nazi for a sponsor doesn't mean that approach is right for all. Just something to think about.

To all the newcomers: sobriety (or spiritual growth) is like riding a bicycle, if you stop you fall off.

Have a great day ODAAT


Member: roger s
Location: Michigan
Date: 3/4/01
Time: 9:10:35 AM

Comments

Roger here an alcoholic... Love and tolerance is making it through this whole page... Taking what helps, leaving what doesn't.


Member: Judi
Location: Alabama
Date: 3/4/01
Time: 10:28:43 AM

Comments

I signed on today to find meetings in Montgomery, Alabama, and found this site instead. ;) Yippeeeeee.